Ranking the Heisei Films

[Dr Kain]

Oddly enough, I've watched Final Wars more than G2K even though I like G2K more.

[DannyBeane]

[jellydonut25]

[Pkmatrix]

Huh...did I never actually post my Heisei rankings in here? I had thought I had, but I can't find the post now...

Anyway:

1. Godzilla vs. Biollante
2. Godzilla 1985 / Return of Godzilla - I prefer the G85 version over RoG.
3. Godzilla vs. Super-Mechagodzilla
4. Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah
5. Godzilla vs. Destroyah
6. Godzilla vs. Mothra
7. Godzilla vs. Space Godzilla

Like a lot of you, the five '90s films are pretty much interchangeable. GvSG is usually at the bottom and GvMG'93 has been at #3 for the last couple of years but I feel pretty much equally toward GvKG, GvM'92, and GvD so they go back and forth - they're basically tied.

At permanent #1 is Biollante, and #2 is Godzilla 1985 - I love these two.

[eabaker]

[Psycho Soldier]

I guess my list would look only slightly different from Pkmatrix's:

Biollante
G85
Destoroyah
Mechagodzilla II
King Ghidorah
Mothra
Spacegodzilla

I can go back and forth on Destoroyah and MG2, but otherwise, my ranking doesn't change too much over time.

[lhb412]

[Jorzilla]

Godzilla vs. Biollante (1989)
Return of Godzilla (1984)
Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)
Godzilla vs. Destoroyah (1995)
Godzilla vs. Mechagodzilla (1993)
Godzilla vs. Spacegodzilla (1994)
Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)

[eabaker]

[lhb412]

[jellydonut25]

Hey, don't forget Shiragami. Just because a character isn't particularly LIKABLE doesn't mean he isn't compelling/interesting. The motivations behind a man voluntarily creating a plantzilla are definitely interesting.

[eabaker]

[O.Supreme]

Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah (1991)
Godzilla vs. Biollante (1989)
Return of Godzilla (1984)
Godzilla vs. Mechagodzilla (1993)
Godzilla vs. Destoroyah (1995)
Godzilla vs. Mothra (1992)
Godzilla vs. Spacegodzilla (1994)

I know that I am the only one here that is going to ever rank G vs KG as #1, and that is ok. I know the film has tremendous flaws. The time travel angle is such a mess, although I do appreciate the lengthy fan explanations of why it "could" work. Additionally the acting on the part of the Caucasian cast is very cringe worthy, I get all that. But from the very time I first saw (and purchased) my first bootleg VHS of this film in July of 1992, there has been one aspect that for some reason outshines all the other Heisei films. That is, simply, Godzilla's appearance, & his power. True, Godzilla's design in Biollante was amazing. But for some reason in vs. KG he just felt even more powerful. Every footstep shook the earth, every firing of his Nuclear breath did not just project out, it felt like an explosion! The two monster fights against King Ghidora, and later in his Mecha King Ghidora form are battles I can watch over and over again. For some reason all that immense power seemed to be lost in the next installment (vs. Mothra), not to mention his nuclear breath having that annoying background noise that made it seems little more effective than your average maser cannon. Godzilla's sense of power did not reach a scale close to this again until Destoroyah, but of course, that film has its own issues. But just for the sake of argument, seeing as how most fans here rank Biollante as #1, I am not inclined to disagree wholeheartedly. It is nice to see as the Heisei films have aged, that this one went from being the "oddball" film in the series, to being held in high regard. It will be interesting to see how this list looks in another 20 years when the next generation comes along, or if us older fans change for one reason or another.

[eabaker]

^Honestly, for me, the first three Heisei flicks are pretty much tied for first place. They're very different from each other, and each works in its own ways. I absolutely agree with you about how impressive Godzilla is in this movie; I attribute some of that to the suit's design, some of that two the way Kawakita shot said suit, some of it to the way that the script builds up his apocalyptic potential, and a LOT of it to Ifukube's ominous scoring.

[O.Supreme]

[DannyBeane]

[Legion]

Watched G'84 with my wife this week for the first time since 2009, hoping to see if would place anywhere higher on my favorites list.

It didn't.

I don't understand how this film is so popular. Or why it's so highly regarded. The Japanese version is a boring slog: the characters are TOTALLY uninteresting, Godzilla sleepwalks through the entire movie, the music (which seems to have a lot of fans) has it's moments, but does NOTHING to increase the impact of Godzilla's attack, which it really needs to because of how mindnumblingly sluggish everything is about almost all of Godzilla's scenes. It's a straight out dull movie. I honestly have more fun reading about it's origins, production and Americanization that I do actually watching the thing. I went into the movie telling my wife it was a decent, popular film, hoping that maybe I'd enjoy it more myself after all this time. We were both so bored by it that we turned it off halfway through and finished it a couple days later. Three choice comments from my wife: "Why does Godzilla look like he's on something?" "These characters are lame, especially her (Naoko)" and "This is sooo boring."

The funny thing is I first saw this in the mid-80s, right along with Terror of MG, Smog Monster, Ghidrah and DAM, all movies I absolutely love. But I don't love this one. Nostalgia can't even help it.

[eabaker]

I totally get why some people find it boring, but for me the slow, steady pace is kind of hypnotic, and I love it.

[klen7]

[DannyBeane]

[klen7]

even as a kid, i hated the bird subplot and thought it ruined the ending.

[jellydonut25]

I'm definitely not in the LOVE IT camp, but I kinda sorta GET why it's so popular. Any time you have something that's "dark and gritty" there will be people who like it for that reason alone. There's a huge subsect not just of Godzilla fandom but of nerd culture in general that feels like these things need to be heavy adult and dark and nasty to give some sort of validity to their reasoning for watching what is otherwise kiddy stuff while they're adults instead of just admitting that kid-stuff can be FUN.

I know that's not EVERYONE, but there IS a portion of people who feel that way.

Then there are the people who are won over by the atmosphere and soundtrack. I am not as swayed, but I have to admit those aspects are well-done. The music I think is really solid and the atmosphere is excellent, with the direction actually being some of the best the series has ever seen. It's unfortunate that the script is so plodding and dull because with something a little more tense and interesting, Hashimoto probably could have turned in a pretty wonderful film.

I think your wife is a TOUCH too harsh on the Godzilla design, but I definitely have moments in this movie when I hate it. It looks great from the back, and mostly good from the sides, but head-on, it DOES look sleepy and derpy. Still, some people overlook these few shots of derpiness and full-on LOVE this design.

So, yeah, this is a movie that I don't personally love, but I can see how SOME do.

[eabaker]

[Legion]

The reason why defending the movie's pace as being hypnotic doesn't work for me is because that's very clearly NOT what the filmmakers were going for. You can tell they're trying to be scary, trying to be dramatic, trying to be intense, trying to do what worked so well thirty years earlier. And as far as I'm concerned, they outright FAILED at it. Actually, let me take that back. They do a really good job of it, at first. The opening scene on the ship is really eerie, and the submarine attack is very, very good. But I really think the movie falls apart once Godzilla appears, especially once he gets ashore and enters Tokyo. I think Godzilla really needed to be more aggressive, the music needed to be more powerful (or at least more ominous) and the characters (good lord, the characters) needed to at least act like they cared about what's going on.

Biollante isn't perfect, but at least in that one Godzilla impresses the hell out of me, and I feel how big of a threat he is. Same with Godzilla vs King Ghidorah. The Godzilla of G84 spends most of his time either standing around, being easily led around or wobbling all over the place because the costume was too big for Satsuma. And the dead, ping pong eyes...

[eabaker]

See, I don't feel like the latter portions of the movie are trying to be scary. I feel like the third act is staged more as a disaster movie than the outright horror of the original, and that Godzilla is meant to represent more majesty and tragedy here than outright monstrosity. A more aggressive Godzilla would have totally failed to set up the melancholy finale, and rendered Hayashida's sympathetic attitude towards him downright bizarre.

But, of course, when intent comes up, I'm almost always going to take a "death of the author" stance anyway. It works for me because, whether its consistent with the design or wholly accidental, I sense a duende there that I find appealing (and, to be clear, I don't think a duende can come from design, only that it can correspond to it). That's a matter wholly of personal, subjective, aesthetic and, at some level, even spiritual (much as I loathe that word) response.

My goal isn't to defend the movie; I know perfectly well that I'm not going to convince you to like something that you don't like, any more than you're going to convince me not to like something that I do like. I'm simply explaining something that I like about it; my saying that the pace has an almost hypnotic effect on me isn't an argument, it's simply a description of my own experience.