TALKBACK: Godzilla (2014) - (OBVIOUS SPOILER DISCUSSION)

[Gojira-2000]

[jellydonut25]

I think the breath's baseline is that it's able to affect the MUTO whereas missiles and rockets do nothing. So baseline is that it's more powerful than a missile.

I'll admit my initial reaction was a little "hrmmm" but as soon as I saw it had basically knocked the MUTO on her ass I was like "oh...ok then. Cool"

[jellydonut25]

[mrbluehair]

Ok, finally have time...

First, I almost didn't go yesterday as we've been under siege by fires in San Diego, made sure we were all clear before we went.

Took my 7 year old, he was stoked then upset when the douche bag promotions guy said we were getting in then said no they had too many people with passes, and had let like 100 people keep going to the front for different reasons. I said "OH GODZILLA! WHAT TERRIBLE LANGUAGE!" that, went to the manager who saw this really cute, sad kid holding his Atomic Roar Godzilla reduced to tears. He snuck us in, sure it was the front right row of a RPX theater...not good seats but my son didn't care and I knew I'd see it again.

After the viewing, the promotions guy was pissed...he said "How did you get in?" I said, "Because I'm me, and my son was promised a movie." He said, "Well we (he and the other promotions douche) had to stand and watch the whole movie." I replied "Well maybe next time you don't give away twice as many tickets than you have seats."

BTW There was about 100 people in front of me who got turned back....not one even tried to get in....sackless. LMAo

OK the movie:

First, It was real fun to see all the images and videos in context in the film, made me think "I remember seeing the missile train and the mess on the lake beach pics"

I thought it was fantastic and that's not a fan opinion, that was me clearing my head of everything and taking each component into consideration, so I'm not really going super spoiler, but look at it from my perspective.

Strong Points:

Characters: Cranston was strong....we knew this and perhaps to the detriment of other characters in the film, but I viewed this differently in that they used him to really draw people into the world and the pain of someone suffering from a traumatic loss. Not totally original, we've seen obsessed characters like this before but he's like a starting pitcher in baseball, generally the best of the best and the longer they can go in the game the better. In this case, he went about 4 innings and got pulled.

ATJ: He was not bad at all, like a long relief pitcher, nothing flashy, job is to get to the end of the game without messing things up, so he did just fine with what he was given and really the story didn't need much but a guide to the final battle. Yeah there may have been too much coincidence for some people but really that happens in many adventure/action movies. I also think he acted as his character was designed, to be more of an anchor, nothing flashy, just doing what he has to do to get the job done and get back to his family. He and the other characters gave us the story and got us to the final battle where we got the fireball relief pitcher.

Elizabeth Olsen: She was kept to a minimum, but did a good job playing her character, she was believable and i thought better than what could have been written in that sometimes these people are made to me more than they are (suddenly heroic and badass) She's a wife, mother and nurse and acted as such, I had no problem with her performance.

Juliette Binoche: Not much to her part, but there was an academy award winner in the film.

Ken Watanabe: I think I liked him the most, the reason being is that I got his character more than most reviews I read and I really believe would be the only real character that I think can be in the total trilogy. The reason is that he's really Godzilla in this movie, he's Godzilla's back story, narrator and admirer. You learn about all the creatures through him and he genuinely doesn't show any darkness you'd expect from a Monarch employee. Maybe a bit short sited in regards to the MUTO's threat, when they realized the MUTO absorbing the radiation led to saving lives after the reactor disaster they acted like I think most government agencies would and focus more on what it was doing than the threat it could eventually pose. Serizawa could be the thread that leads us through the entire trilogy and have the other cast revolve with each film. The difficulty with carrying characters through these films as it was shown by Toho is that really there are 3 kinds of people that can repeatedly show up in the films: Military obsessed with destroying the creatures, Scientists wanting to study/destroy them and reporters. Therefore there is no reason to continue with the Brody family, their story is closed and that's fine.

Sally Hawkins: She's a fine flunkie to Serizawa, could be in further films, did nothing wrong and could have even been left out to give Serizawa more lines and screentime.

David Straithaim: He played a no nonsense character, not some dopey military guy or one who shouts all the time (GINO) just as you'd really expect the guy in charge to be. I liked his character and it served it's purpose just fine.

MUTO's: Great new characters with more personality than I'd expect. The female was the brute we all heard she was going to be...actually more massive than I thought, and the male was the cheap shot artist using speed, agility and flight to do his best to fight Godzilla and defend his mate. They had an attack plan for Godzilla that you felt was one that had played out when they roamed the earth. I didn't even mind that they had a bit more time than Godzilla, being new and the real threat, they needed to be a bit more visible so everyone could get them and visually understand them.

Godzilla: I really loved how he was executed visually and how he truly was indifferent to the humans so long as they weren't shooting him. Shots of him swimming alongside the naval ships was great, he never retreated but you never got the feeling that he was menacing the humans...his job was to kick the "OH GODZILLA! WHAT TERRIBLE LANGUAGE!" out of the MUTOS, buildings and ships be damned. He was a brute, and very Toho like would go after the female and get blind sided by the male, As for the Atomic breath, I loved it, great representation because I really do not like the breath that annihilates everything, On other monsters it should be painful and do damage but not blow them up and the fatality shot in the end was "OH GODZILLA! WHAT TERRIBLE LANGUAGE!" awesome, you really thought "Ahh this was instinct." The way it could have been conveyed better is simple, had he used his breath and hit a building and we saw the damage it caused to something like that, it would have made the firepower understandable and the durability of the MUTO's understandable. I hope they do not change it. The fact that a building knocked him silly was fine, he was exhausted by the battle and him passing out after the fight was done is really nothing new in this series, time and again we see Godzilla fight, fall and rise again to win the battle. He gave it everything he had and we got that (and the characters too) sure it makes him more heroic than anti hero but that's what a trilogy needs IMO.

The cinematography was beautiful, I really liked the diverse looks and there were just some beautiful shots we don't see in this found footage, grainy, shaky cam, lens flare world. Nice panning shots and wide shots where you actually see the action. Because of this I really think makes people think the monster battle footage could have been longer because we could actually SEE what was happening. They even took some elevated human vantage points to give us a real Toho feel and that was awesome.

The crowd loved it, and the reactions were similar to what the others experienced with cheers and a couple chuckles in the same places (thankfully no stupid humor was shoehorned in) I really liked the TV shots, the fight in Honolulu got a chuckle (dinosaurs) and the casino folk not seeing the female thrashing the city till it smashed the casino roof.

The Future: They really left it wide open to anything being possible with this film and still have a real source. Godzilla has a purpose that people in that world understand, it allows for other creatures and characters to be created.

Here's how I see it playing it out: Second movie follows Serizawa's study of Godzilla while Monarch looks into other finds they've uncovered over the years they can exploit becoming the evil organization we thought they would be and secretly creating monsters to do their dirty work and perhaps the massive monster battle in the 3rd act where Godzilla and a creation of Serizawa go toe to toe with the evil Monarch's creatures. Or not, just thinking on the fly.

So I give it 4.5 out of 5 bluehairs, and I thank Gareth and Legendary for a really fun movie.

Oh and the airport scene was quite different than the SDCC footage, it was a longer fight with MUTO before Godzilla appears and the scene ends. MUTO also looked quite different from the early footage. Not to mention the fact they used many lines in the trailers that were not in the film (7 year old son asked about the pre HALO jump speech) So it's cool in a sense they let the non fan know things with scenes not in the movie therefore not having too much "I've seen that" issues.

[mrbluehair]

[king_ghidorah]

I just want to say that I agree completely with pretty much everything that Jorzilla has said. Great minds think alike


I was thinking about the baseline to the atomic blast a day or two ago as well. It might feel more powerful had it been deployed on something more destructible. The first time it was used kind of underwhelmed me and the second is over quickly. Even if they could have just shown the concussive force of the ray stripping the sides of buildings or something as it passed, lighting things on fire without ever touching them. Just something....

Also, it is very much a MUTO movie first and foremost.

[Gojira-2000]

One thing that is bothering me from one of the clips, is the one where Godzilla rises among the naval ships. When I read that Godzilla tends to go out of his way to avoid harming humans intentionally I was surprised that he chose to surface directly under the ships scattered across the bay when he arrived in San Fransisco. Surely that'd have caused damage to those ships, maybe even breaking the the keel of the ships, and endangering the crew aboard. Even if it didn't break, wasn't there also a chance of at least one of the ships capsizing? To me it was an odd choice that he surfaced there rather than where there wasn't surface traffic directly above him; I mean there's plenty of open water when they first spot his plates breaking the surface.

[Gorjira54]

[jellydonut25]

I think the atomic breath "baseline" is that it's stronger than any missile or rocket in the American military's arsenal.

MUTO is hit with artillery and doesn't react. Godzilla uses his breath and she recoils and then collapses in pain for a period of time (and then later is killed by it). So, obviously the breath is pretty GD strong.


As to your point about "Don't give away so many tickets" or whatever. They do that on purpose. They want to GUARANTEE a full showing, but people who are in the press or win "legitimate" contests (like through REAL sponsors like for example Kia) get guaranteed seats. The stuff they give away for these pre-screenings is not guaranteed and just to fill out the rest of the house. This allows them to get a judge of what crowds will think, how many screens to have for the movie, and honestly, the more people they turn away, the more people hear that "nobody could get in because it was sooo packed" and the more buzz is drummed up. It's cool that you got in and all, but I got there over 4 hours early to get into my screening...

[mrbluehair]

No jelly I get the too many tickets thing, I'm just not one to disappoint my son and had we not been told we were getting in id have not gotten pissed.

Besides, you are talking to the guy who got his SDCC badge and 20 minutes later was in Hall H while 8000 other people with no creativity and stones waited outside. Sometimes you have to take what you want so others don't run you down. I mean really, do I feel bad that people waited for days in line when all I did was make a t-shirt and tell them my wife was inside the place? He'll no! I'd do it again too.

As for SDCC muto it was pale gray, a little more spindly with a more horizontal back and the wings were not defined. Plus the eyes were black not red so it was more a visual test piece.

[gila-monster]

I just saw an advanced screening and I felt it was a great movie. Godzilla was treated like an actual character of the film with personality, making it feel like an actual Godzilla movie. The music was good for the most part, I especially enjoyed the dissonant 20th century classical music put in during some of the intense moments. It would have been nice to have more of that during the climax of the film.

I do think Godzilla could have used more screen time, especially at the climax of the film. Not a whole lot, but I think more of the final fights should have been shown, especially after all the teases we got throughout. Speaking of which, the television segment of Godzilla and the MUTO fighting on Hawaii reminded me of the Godzilla vs King Kong puppet scenes in its climax.

The characters and human drama felt just like Edwards' first film Monsters. It was well done for the most part, with minimal cliche and sappyness. Unfortunately it did make it seem like Godzilla was a side character in his own film a lot of the times, but I will say that whenever Godzilla was on screen it was well done and he had a great presence. Not so big on some of the close up roar scenes though. I loved the balance between seriousness and science fiction b-movies. A lot of the science fictiony aspects reminded me more of classic films from the 50's and 60's rather than more recent films, which was a nice change.

Overall it was like a great movie, whether as a stand alone or a first in a series. Definitely a strong world builder, but complete enough to be a one-off.

[Russzilla]

Quick question. Do we get the Godzilla walking into (and through) the ocean shot that we've seen many times in past movies? (waiting until he arises again)

[Jorzilla]

He swims like all of the other Godzillas, but he doesn't do that odd view where it looks like he's walking across the ocean. He kind of might at the end, but it's also supposed to be in shallow water.

[Russzilla]

[Russzilla]

[Jorzilla]

In the last shot he walks into the water but only as long as it takes him to get into a horizontal position.

[mrbluehair]

Yeah he wades out into the bay till it was deep enough for him to just lay out and swim back under water until his dorsal fins disappear. Very smooth and natural looking, not like Heisei where he would faceplant into the water (because the suit didn't allow the head to lift up of course, though I always laughed at the faceplant into the water)

The more I think about it the more I believe Serizawa is the voice of Godzilla. Since he can't talk (but boy can you see his attitude which was great) he was used to commentate.

[Psycho Soldier]

Just got back from it. Even if this is just the hype talking, YOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

This one's a solid 9 out of 10 for me. I'll leave a couple of points non-spoilered since they're not about the plot in any way, but after that, I'm not holding anything back. Yet there are some things you absolutely must see for yourself in the theater, so . Trust me, I know there are people lurking in this thread who haven't, so I put big emphases on this for a reason. Also, there's no real structured review here; I'm just going off the cuff.

So this is the first and only movie I've seen in 3D. Initially I hated it, but once the movie was underway, it more or less ceased to matter. Actually, I thought it enhanced the experience quite a bit. Don't know that I'd see another movie in 3D after this, but for Godzilla, it absolutely worked. It was a useful tool to convey the scale of the monsters and carnage. Perhaps the sequel should be filmed with 3D cameras? I don't know how different that would look compared to a post-conversion, but it seems to me that 3D and kaiju go well together. (Mind you, I'm also that moron who flinches at 'in-your-face' 3D effects, so take my words with as small a grain of salt as you see fit.)

Desplat's soundtrack worked fine in the movie context. I already liked it apart from the film, and I feel it was even better within it. The elements that are annoying on a straight listen - the shaku, for example - aren't nearly as much so here, due to the staggering of musical and non-musical sequences. I think Desplat would be a fine choice for the sequel, if not necessarily my first. (My pipe dream is either Hiroyuki Sawano or Jeremy Soule - it's a toss-up.)

I'll refrain from ranking it among the other Godzilla films until I have my Godzilla marathon. I'm tempted to slot it in at #3 or so, but let's not get carried away.

[jellydonut25]

[gila-monster]

[Henry88]

Godzilla Set To Destroy Weekend Box Office According To Social Data
http://www.forbes.com/sites/sap/2014/05 ... cial-data/

Box Office Preview: 'Godzilla' Hopes to Scale $65 Million Debut
http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/b ... pes-704341

‘Godzilla’ Director Knows What He Wants From A Sequel
http://www.mtv.com/news/1825041/godzill ... h-edwards/

[Dai]

I booked the afternoon off from work to see the movie, and thoroughly enjoyed it. Rest assured that everything Emmerich messed up in '98, Edwards gets right here. It's such an authentic-feeling Godzilla movie that it slots effortlessly alongside the Toho movies. Edwards strikes an interesting balance between portraying Godzilla and the MUTOs as animals within an eco-system, as he did so well in Monsters, while lending them the mythic gravitas that's the hallmark of true kaiju.

The pacing feels very old-school, but in a good way. Terminator 2 rewrote the Hollywood blockbuster playbook by saying that you could have a major action climax in each act rather than just at the end of the movie. Since then, every summer tentpole has clawed to outdo the last--more, more, more--resulting in some of the flashy-but-numbing fare we see today. Godzilla 2014 takes its time. I've read comparisons to early Spielberg, and those ring true. There's still plenty of action, with the MUTOs in particular being a heavy presence throughout the movie, but each scene builds on the last until we reach the final showdown. Compare that to Pacific Rim, which, for all its retro trappings, is built very much as a modern blockbuster. The result was that PR blew its load halfway through, and what should have been the true climax ending up feeling like sloppy seconds.

The real weakness is the characters. The actors do an at least servicable job in their roles (Cranston is outstanding), but most aren't given enough to work with. The problem is lack of conflict. Think about Godzilla 1954. That movie crackled with character conflicts, both internal and external. Emi struggles with the need to betray her promise to keep Serizawa's secret. Serizawa is torn between the consequences of using the oxygen destroyer and the consequences of not using it. In Godzilla 2014, the only barriers to progress are physical, not emotional. This is most telling in that it fumbles one of the keystones of the Hollywood formula, the reconciliation with the relationship/dynamic character. Here's how G'14's structure breaks down:

Protagonist: Ford Brody. What he wants: to get back to his family and protect them.
Relationship character: Joe Brody. What he's trying to convey to the protagonist: the importance of protecting one's family at all costs.
Antagonist: MUTO. Poses a danger to Ford's family.

For the reconciliation to work, the protagonist must initally reject what the relationship character is trying to tell him. The problem here is that, while the film hints at Ford being an absent father, as Joe seemingly was, there's not enough pulling Ford in different directions between what he needs to do (help the military defeat MUTO) and what he wants (to get back to his family). In fact, the two converge too easily. By helping the military defeat MUTO, Ford protects his family, and the route MUTO takes ultimately leads him straight home. There's never a sense that he has to sacrifice one for the sake of the other.

Compare this to Spielberg's War of the Worlds, which also has a protagonist who wants to reunite his family. When his ex-wife wearily tells him to take care of their kids, she only means it in the context of a normal weekend (pre-alien invasion), and clearly doesn't think he's up to even that task. Even when the aliens arrive and start slaughtering people, his thought is that he only needs to look after his kids long enough to get them back to their mother. As the story progresses, he learns what being a real father means. When he's reunited with his ex-wife at the end, there's a note of respect between them that would have been impossible if he'd remained the deadbeat he started as. It's this conflict and cathartic resolution that's missing from Godzilla 2014. Joe is long-forgotten by the movie's climax, with Ford following the pre-established military operation to the letter in a way that manages to fulfil both what he needs to do and what he wants. I feel that the pieces for a better execution of this were available, or even present, but passed uncommented in the movie's unusually dialogue-free final act, having been smoothed into oblivion by so many writers revising the script.

That's just the writer in me complaining interminably though. The bottom line is that Godzilla 2014 delivers much of what we hoped for, and for so long seemed impossible: a big budget American Godzilla movie that respects the character, respects the genre, and feels like a Toho movie on a grand scale.

[Henry88]

"

[Kailem]

Just got back from seeing it, and I really enjoyed it.

*SPOILERS, obviously, because obvious spoiler discussion*

Lots of moments that made me smile. I really loved the opening title sequence, getting straight into showing glimpses of Godzilla in old newsreel footage before the nuke cutting to white, then slowly fading in the "Godzilla" title was really effective I thought. I loved the buildup of tension in a lot of scenes, like the MUTO hatching and the whole Hawaii sequence culminating in Godzilla's reveal and his first roar. Serizawa naming Godzilla for the first time as "Gojira", and the reverence with which they talked about him (the "is this him?" bit at the start for example was one of many nice touches that really gave you a feel for how this wasn't just some random creature, but something special).

I loved that Godzilla had personality, and I was actually surprised by how much of an outright hero the movie portrayed him to be. He never once targeted humans or the military, to the point where the Navy was basically escorting him to San Francisco at one point, and any time it looked like he might collide with a ship he dived to avoid them. I'm sure some people might not like that he was portrayed in such a positive light when so many of the film makers have been referring back to the original film as their source of inspiration for this new film and maybe weren't expecting him to be more akin to the Showa superhero-type of Godzilla, but I really liked it.

The Muto's were cool as well, and I liked how they were both slightly different. I suspected from the falling jets in the trailers that they probably had some sort of EMP attack (I've been avoiding anything even remotely related to the leak script because I didn't want to know any of that sort of stuff beforehand), so it was cool to see they weren't just big monsters but had special attacks like a lot of classic kaiju do.

And yes, Godzilla's beam attack! Another smiley moment, I was so wrapped up in the film I'd forgotten that we hadn't seen it yet; and then the screen started glowing blue. That was a really cool moment. I do agree that the thinner beam did perhaps make it look a bit weak/not as "beefy" as the classic one often has, but it was still just great to see, and firing the beam right into the female Muto's throat was a great final move. Didn't that old Terry Rossio/Ted Elliot script end with Godzilla decapitating the Gryphon in San Francisco too? Either way, a cool finish that's different to anything we've seen before.

Visually I thought he looked great as well, and pretty much all the little nitpicks I had with the design weren't even an issue actually seeing him in motion. The feet you only see that one time in the airport scene, I'd forgotten he was even maybe supposed to have gills (not that that ever really bothered me anyway because they were pretty subtle), and there were really only a couple of shots where I thought he still looked a little wide, but overall he looked great. Seeing all those unused alternate designs from the art book definitely shows they went with the right one in the end.

I also just loved how much it "felt" like a Godzilla movie beyond the obvious. Lots of cool military action, Japanese locations, jungles, an airport scene, so much of it just felt right. It was good stuff.

As for criticisms, I largely agree with most of Jorzilla's points (though my mind never once wandered back to Jurassic Park, except for during some of the shots like the ones from inside the school bus which reminded me of how Spielberg kept the camera inside the vehicle during most of the opening part of the T-Rex scene). The human characters were pretty underdeveloped, and it's a shame Bryan Cranston dropped out of the movie fairly early on, as he felt like a stronger lead than ATJ, plus there was more family stuff I felt like they could have utilised between the two of them but didn't because they killed Cranston off. I guess they just figured that once Johnson went off to protect/disarm the nuke that they wouldn't be able to have much interaction anyway, but it was still a shame to lose such a strong actor. I liked Ken Watanabe's Serizawa, and as mentioned earlier he really was the "voice" of Godzilla in a way. I liked the scene between him and David Strathairn where he showed him the watch and you immediately understood his feeling on nuclear weapons and why he was reluctant to go along with the military's plan. We could have done with more of that sort of stuff.

I also thought they really took it down to the wire with giving Godzilla enough screen time. Any less and it would have been a real problem, but I felt like ultimately there was just enough - just. I think less people would have had a problem with it if they didn't majorly cock-tease us with two epic battles that we then never see. The airport scene is built up fantastically, and Godzilla's reveal is great. Then, just when the fight is about to start, it cuts away and other than a couple of brief shots on a TV, there's no fight. Then when Godzilla and the Mutos finally reach San Francisco, they do the same thing again, cutting away just as the fight begins, and then when you see the city later it's nighttime and half of it is on fire. I was honestly worried they were going to pull it a third time when Godzilla distracted the Mutos from their nest and they went off to fight, only for the focus to stay on the soldiers.

I love movies like Alien and Jaws where the title creatures don't actually get a whole lot of screen time between them, but I think the way they handle several of the "not showing too much" scenes here is what's bothering people. I was fine with not seeing Godzilla himself for so long into the film because we still got that very cool Muto hatching scene as well as its initial attack on Hawaii and EMP'ing the jet and stuff, plus just the cool buildup (the completely kaiju-free Janjira scene was great and I loved the tense buildup and Bryan Cranston's reaction when the trapped people started banging on the door only to then see his wife) but the constant cutting away from major scenes right as an epic battle is about to start definitely irked me.

Oh yeah and they really did get me for a moment with wondering whether or not they'd really killed off Godzilla at the end. Since they'd established that he was just one of a race of ancient creatures just like him, I wondered if they were just going to kill this one then have another one take his place in any sequels, since they'd kept referencing the original 1954 film so much during the promotion of this. Definitely another 'moment o' smiling' when he started breathing again and opened his eyes, and Serizawa smiled. Then the news footage with the "King of the Monsters" title in it. Great stuff (though I was a little surprised we didn't get any sort of shots of anyone telling David Strathairn's character that Godzilla was still alive and asking whether or not he wanted them to open fire on him or something, given that they were fully intending to kill Godzilla with the nuke as well, and then him saying "no" when it became clear that he was leaving the city and walking back out into the bay).

And that is one of the reasons I try to avoid spoilers like leaked scripts. That scene wouldn't have been nearly as satisfying if I hadn't doubted for a minute whether or not he was dead, nor the feels so strong if I'd known before I even walked into the cinema that he didn't die at the end.

I generally suck at rating things, but I'll go with 8 out of 10 for this one. Not perfect and with room for improvement in the sequel should we be lucky enough to get one, but a great start and a lot of fun. They did the big guy proud.

[jellydonut25]

I thought the news part was done really well. In fact, most of the people in my theater found it fun and even chuckled.

Like you said, it was the second time where people were like, "...AGAIN?!?!"