TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Discuss the millennium era of Godzilla films! From Godzilla 2000 Millennium to Godzilla Final Wars, these films comprised a wide variety of styles and topics!

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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby MekaGojira3k » Wed Apr 16, 2014 1:04 pm

Just re-watched this yesterday and it jumped like 10 spots or so on my rankings list. It's weird, when it came out I think it was overshadowed by Tokyo S.O.S. (which I saw like 4 months later at G-Fest). It fell a few notches, and suddenly on this viewing it jumped up a few notches. It's a pretty good movie. Seriously, I'm kind of surprised by it. I feel like things like GMK may have made Tezuka and company feel as though they needed to up their ante. The unmoving Godzilla isn't even as bad as I remembered. It's just that first scene with Kiryu and even then it works in terms of making Kiryu and the masers, to a lesser extent, seem like a potent weapon against Godzilla.

Now to find out if S.O.S. holds up or slides further down (as it has been doing since I first saw it).
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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby Jorzilla » Sat May 10, 2014 12:26 am

10+ years later, I still can't decide if it's offensive to the original film makers intent, or cool, that Kiryu was built on the ones of the original Godzilla.
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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby MouthForWar » Sat May 10, 2014 8:11 am

I just rewatched this the other night and enjoyed it more than I have in the past. Probably my 5th or so viewing and I'm finally starting to come around more on this one and see why people like it so much. It probably keeps its same ranking in my overall ranking of the series, but like I said, I'm finally "getting" it as far as this film goes.

I still think I prefer Tokyo SOS more just because of the monster stuff in that film. This movie has excellent human drama, while Tokyo SOS has excellent monster action. Unfortunately, neither film share both of those elements.

I think a lot of Tokyo SOS' problems could have been solved by carrying over the lead characters from this film... their decision not to do that was a huge mistake, IMO.
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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby Psycho Soldier » Sun May 25, 2014 4:57 am

MouthForWar wrote:I still think I prefer Tokyo SOS more just because of the monster stuff in that film. This movie has excellent human drama, while Tokyo SOS has excellent monster action. Unfortunately, neither film share both of those elements.


I'm on the other side of the fence. I've always preferred GxMG over TSOS, although, as a kid, I simply thought the former was flashier and more entertaining. I still think so, but now it's precisely the human drama that pushes it over the top. At the risk of being shot at, I consider Akane to be one of the few characters in the series who has a solid emotional arc. She's working out her issues of guilt while also dealing with the pressures from her male colleagues. It's actually pretty engaging. I'm not sure I totally agree with the post-credits resolution, though I suppose it points to her opening up to those around her, which is still okay. I'm glad that TSOS gives her a decent send-off. I might've preferred that she and the rest of the pilots stuck around, but whatever.

Also, we never really do learn in TSOS how things went between Akane and Tokumitsu, do we? I don't believe he's ever mentioned. I tend to think they didn't go too well, especially with her going to the USA and all, but that's just my own speculation.
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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby Hybrid Gojira » Sun May 25, 2014 5:54 am

It's been awhile since I've seen this, but I do like it. It has a cool opening sequence (although it feels like Tezuka's just ripping off his own movie Megaguirus at the beginning) and I love Kiryu's rampage. It's certainly a flawed movie but one I can enjoy none the less.
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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby MekaGojira3k » Sun May 25, 2014 6:42 pm

It's definitely rehashing Megaguirus (which is rehashing elements from vs. SpaceGodzilla), but Tezuka rehashes himself.
At least x MechaGodzilla does a better job of things.
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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby goji4ever » Sat May 31, 2014 7:09 pm

The intro sequence had better ideas in G vs Megs but the execution in goji x mecha is leagues better.. Plus the upgraded Godzilla march helps as well.
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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby Rodanex » Mon Jun 02, 2014 9:49 am

MekaGojira3k wrote:It's definitely rehashing Megaguirus (which is rehashing elements from vs. SpaceGodzilla), but Tezuka rehashes himself.
At least x MechaGodzilla does a better job of things.


How does GXM rehash elements of Godzilla vs. SpaceGodzilla?
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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby MekaGojira3k » Mon Jun 02, 2014 10:45 am

Rodanex wrote:
MekaGojira3k wrote:It's definitely rehashing Megaguirus (which is rehashing elements from vs. SpaceGodzilla), but Tezuka rehashes himself.
At least x MechaGodzilla does a better job of things.


How does GXM rehash elements of Godzilla vs. SpaceGodzilla?


MAH FRAND IS DEAD. I HATE YOU GODZILLA.

GXM even has soldiers on foot taking on Godzilla, like the ANEB delivery mission in Godzilla vs. Biollante. That features Gondo's death which is the drive for Yuki wanting to kill SpaceGodzilla.
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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby Giganfan » Tue Jun 03, 2014 2:37 pm

The thing I like the most about Godzilla X Mechagodzilla is that it gets right to the business of being a Godzilla movie. Sure, the characters are thinly-drawn, and the story is somewhat under-developed, but when considered within the proper context (that is to say, almost 80% of the movies in the series are plagued with similar problems, and a good deal of them follow a pre-set "corporate Toho-approved" formula), I was thoroughly impressed with how director, Tezuka handles the material. The whole thing is kept fast-paced and light, and unlike his predecessor, Takao Okawara, the minute you begin to feel bogged down by a boring plot element or an annoying character, he's real good at getting you in-and-out, without breaking the flow of the action. Tezuka is, by no means, as competent a filmmaker as, say, Shusuke Kaneko or Jun Fukuda or even Kazuki Omori. And he sure-as-sh*t is no Ishiro Honda. However, his passion for Godzilla movies is undeniable, and I think that is what gives his three contributions to the Godzilla legacy a special kind of luster.

Make no mistake, if I were to be totally objective on the matter, I'd say that Godzilla X Mechagodzilla is no better, or no worse than anything else that Toho has been churning out over the past few decades. But I think the blame for that has much more to do with the company's stinginess with time, budgetary constraints and an unwillingness to go out and find some really talented filmmakers, or at least give the ones they have the freedom to develop their projects as they see fit. In a vacuum, I'd say that at the very least, Tezuka's three Godzilla films are the best of the "meh" films in the series, which when you really think about it, isn't so bad. I certainly rank this one among my personal favorites (though my most recent listings in the "Godzilla In General" forum have yet to reflect that, damn it!).
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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby Hybrid Gojira » Wed Sep 03, 2014 1:27 pm

Going back through this thread out of boredom...it's odd how my opinion changed on this film. I'm planning to rewatch this with SOS (and Megaguirus) soon.
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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby Hybrid Gojira » Mon Sep 08, 2014 2:05 am

Watched this tonight (my wife and I are actually watching the whole series) and it was better than I remembered.

The score is great. The Godzilla theme is big and powerful, but the other themes in this film drive it home for me. The characters are better done in this than they were in Tezuka's previous outing. Our main heroine is an improved version of Tsujimori named Akane, who is responsible for the deaths (albeit somewhat indirectly) of her comrades during Godzilla's first appearance. She crashes into them, knocking them into the path of Goji, who then promptly stomps on their vehicle. Akane wrestles with this throughout the film and must deal with the backlash of Hayama, the brother of one of the men she killed. Overall, though Akane is very quiet and reserved throughout the film, but her reclusion is basically the one thing she knows. Her character is nothing earth shattering, but I enjoyed it enough to keep interested throughout.

Godzilla's design is (IMO) much improved from the two earlier millennium films. This time his look is more traditional and toned down. While his dorsal plates are still spikey, they aren't quite the exaggerated design we had before plus we see the return of the blue beam. What does big me is the unevenness Godzilla is portrayed with in this film. In his first encounter with the JSDF, Goji stands around and is happy to get blasted, at least until the masers are fired. He looks lifeless at times, and this is true of his first encounter with Kiryu. Later on, G is blasting everything in sight and even does a 180 to blast a jet out of the sky. Godzilla is too stagnant and frankly not very animated.

The effects in this movie are also better than they were in G2K or GXM. The miniatures look great at times, especially the first scene where Godzilla treks through the countryside in the rain. Though there are some bad CGI shots, the majority aren't terrible and the mattes work much better than some of the embarrassing stuff in the previous 2 films. A negative note here are some of edits and physics shown in Kiryu's fight when G. Yes it's a Godzilla film, but Kiryu is often sent flying in an odd direction considering where the attack came from. It's distracting.

Kiryu is an improvement on Heisei MG. I like all the new weapons and the rampage scene is very cool and a nice plot idea...but then it suddenly vanishes during the second fight. Yes, they supposedly fix Kiryu, but it would have been good to revisit that later in the film.

One note I'd like to make - the Showa films did a great job of blending the color matte of the SPFX shots with the real life shots. The millennium films to this point struggle to bring that same vibrant color scheme into the daytime shots, especially the city miniatures (although as mentioned, the rain scene in this film is wonderfully done).

Overall, I liked this movie more than G2K or GXM. It's not perfect, but it's a fun movie that plays well into the next entry which I hope to rewatch soon.
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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby KingKaiju » Tue Oct 14, 2014 1:57 pm

I've always wondered something: why did Toho decide to call MechaGodzilla Kiryu?? I personally never understood it, and it always sounded kind of dumb to me. Just one of those things I never understood.
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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby DannyBeane » Tue Oct 14, 2014 2:09 pm

I think it had to do with the fact that Kiryu was more of a character and because there was more interaction between Akane and Kiryu. Having Akane scream out MECHAGODZILLA! would have been awkward.
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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby Mexigojira » Fri Jan 23, 2015 3:17 am

Am I the only one that noticed the Hamtaro reference? :shock:
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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby Shin_Edda_Robo!!!!! » Sat Jan 24, 2015 8:17 pm

Mexigojira wrote:Am I the only one that noticed the Hamtaro reference? :shock:


No, I got it right away the girl in the red shirt and twin tails was dressed.
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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby Mexigojira » Sun Jan 25, 2015 11:42 pm

Shin_Edda_Robo!!!!! wrote:
Mexigojira wrote:Am I the only one that noticed the Hamtaro reference? :shock:


No, I got it right away the girl in the red shirt and twin tails was dressed.


Make you wonder that of all worlds, there is a universe were the lovable Hamtaro and friends live in the same universe were rampanging kaijus roam the earth. :D
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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby klen7 » Mon Jan 26, 2015 10:06 am

Wasn't this film released as a double feature with Hamtaro in Japan?
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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby MekaGojira3k » Mon Jan 26, 2015 12:29 pm

klen7 wrote:Wasn't this film released as a double feature with Hamtaro in Japan?


Yep. GMK, this, and S.O.S. all were.
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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby Mexigojira » Tue Jan 27, 2015 3:03 am

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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby Hybrid Gojira » Sun Feb 08, 2015 3:06 am

I like GXMG and SOS. They're probably my favorite two movies out of the Millenium series. GMK is probably better in some respects, but I like these more.
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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby Dr Kain » Fri Feb 13, 2015 1:27 am

Hybrid Gojira wrote:Godzilla's design is (IMO) much improved from the two earlier millennium films. This time his look is more traditional and toned down. While his dorsal plates are still spikey, they aren't quite the exaggerated design we had before plus we see the return of the blue beam.


Can I honestly say I am an idiot? Now that I think about it, even though I have watched the movies several times, I really never looked at the Godzilla suit as anything more than the 2000 suit but with a small head and gray spines. I just started looking at some pictures of the suit and you're right, it takes what I love about the traditional suits and combines it with what I love about the 2000 suit. In fact, I think I might have just fallen in love with the suit, perhaps even moreso than the GMK suit.
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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby kiryugoji04 » Fri Feb 13, 2015 6:41 am

Kiryugoji is the best suit. Fact.
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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby lhb412 » Sat Feb 14, 2015 7:49 pm

I think it's kind of a bland design. It's slightly less artificial and awkward than G2K, but now lacks the weird extreme-ness that made the earlier design work (even though that design looked really bad from some angles). This design has this weird, hooked muzzle shape which I don't care for. A bit of a beak. I feel the Legendary Godzilla did a much better job of incorporating bird features into Godzilla's face.

I do like the scarring on Godzilla in Tokyo SOS.


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Re: TALKBACK #26: Godzilla Against Mechagodzilla

Postby Dr Kain » Sun Feb 15, 2015 1:33 pm

Every Godzilla design looks bad from certain angles though. That is just how it is. The Heisei designs have thunder thighs. The GMK one has a beer gut. The original has that weird squish in his head. The 64 one has the loose snout. The 73 suit has that smile. The 68 those eyes. The 67 one has that entire head and neck. Final Wars has the spines.
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