TALKBACK #19: Godzilla and Mothra, The Battle for Earth

[Irish Gfan]

This is one of the weaker entries in the Heisei series for sure. I love the monster action and Battra is very cool. But the message is way to heavy handed.

It isn't that I hate environmental messages, but this one felt really forced. Godzilla originally was a metaphor for the dangers of nuclear radiation. It was a very real potential danger that was showcased through a fantasy creature. I could say the same thing about Hedorah as well. Sure they pounded the message home in that movie too, but at least they used Hedorah to showcase the real potential dangers of pollution. This one, I am not sure of the connection between cutting down trees and a giant death moth coming after me. Is the message don't cut down trees or the Earth will get pissed off and kill you? If so, that isn't very realistic. Truthfully, they just wanted to drive their message home whether it made sense or not.

Getting into the human characters, I could have done without the blatant Indiana Jones ripoff scenes. The whole story with the divorced couple and their kid is something that a director like Honda could have handled beautifully, but here, it just feels disconnected from everything else and not important enough to pay attention too.

Some other minor nitpicks, this is the movie where they switched Godzilla's roar back to the higher pitch one from the Showa series rather than the deeper growl that was used in the original film and the first three entries of the Heisei series. Why they made this change, I don't know, but I don't like it for this Godzilla. The Godzilla of the 90s was a hulking mass and that higher pitched roar coming out of it felt wrong. It worked in the 60s & 70s, especially when they went into the process of softening Godzilla's character. They also changed the sound effect of Godzilla's nuclear blast, switching from the gushing water sound to the generic laser beam sound. Thankfully this change did not last as I prefer the gushing water sound. It sounds like something powerful is being forced out from within with that sound effect. The generic laser beam sound I could assign to anything.

But like I said, I love the monster action in this one. Godzilla's battle with the Mothra & Battra larvae was a nice action scene at sea. And the final battle was actually the closest we've ever had a three way battle in the Godzilla series. The Ferris wheel was a nice way to make the scene stand out among other Godzilla battles too. And like I said, Battra looks awesome, probably more so in larva form than in adult. It just looks so much cooler than Mothra, whose return is well done as well. She looks as cutesy as always and maintains the majestic quality of the original.

[jellydonut25]

The message in this movie is truly awful. Half the stuff blamed on humanity's disrespect of the earth is the gault of the meteor and the other half is a result of bad writing

[MekaGojira3k]

This movie is dumb.
Why the hell can't all of these government officials get the Cosmos from Marotomo? They're from the GOVERNMENT, and I'm pretty sure publicizing this blatant kidnapping would definitely come off in their favor.

I also think the movie should have just stuck with NATURE GONE AMOK as its "theme". Meteorite awakens Godzilla/Battra/causes everything is a lot cooler. In fact, there's more in the script to support this than the "OH IT'S MANKIND BEIN' AWFUL"

That's only there for Marutomo, which is only there to rely heavily on references to Mothra.

Battra is the one kind of GOOD thing in this movie. Mostly because I love the idea that there were two of these guardians of the Earth with different agendas/means of accomplishing their defense of earth. In fact, that's the only thing I like about the Heisei era. Even if it did it in awful ways it really expanded upon the Mothra mythology. I like it.

But at the end of the day I kind of can't stand this film. I suppose that's due to mankind's ability to pollute and cause typhoons and landslides on islands they haven't wrecked yet.

[Rody]

I had forgotten just how dumb this movie is.

Godzilla vs Mothra is the Last Airbender of the Godzilla franchise - dull, lifeless, and completely inept at handling its source material. The film is practically a cut-and-paste of Mothra(1961) with touches of Mothra vs. Godzilla(1964), but without any of the creative skill present in those classics. That's not even mentioning the tacky sub-plots and American blockbuster ripoffs which pad out the film.
I honestly have trouble trying to think of a major positive to this movie. The pacing is a drag through the entire film. The acting is even duller (and the dubbing doesn't help at all). The sets are decent, but there are sparklers everywhere; and Mothra & Battra are the most pathetic flyers I've ever seen. Seriously, they just hang there! Topping it all off is the inane environmental message. Hardly any indications are given as to how manking is responsible for awakening the three monsters. Sure, Takarada's character (poor Takarada looked rather bored) claims that "the meteor was merely a detonator to the time bomb created by us humans", but that's nothing but a cop-out.
Overall, this is probably my least favorite Godzilla film; Lazy film making at its worst.


Some random thoughts:

I noticed when Godzilla emerges for the first fight scene that, hey, his arms were actually pretty free! (as opposed to being stuck to the torso by the elbows like it always looks in the 90's) Too bad he still mostly just beam-spammed.

BAD beam sound effect. BAD.

I really wonder why they chose to recycle Rodan's roar again. Granted, Rodan has a great roar, but when they already used it twice in vs. King Ghidorah, and then feature Rodan himself in the next film, it appears particularly awkward.

I don't agree with those who call the underwater battle the highlight of the movie. Sure, fighting underwater is a neat concept, but once again, we mostly just get beam volleys.
...Although the drop-swing or whatever you call it is always a welcome sight.

Now, the volcano sequence was impressive. I'd like to see how they constructed that.

Mothra moves sooooo sloooowwwwwly....

I'm not keen on the Cosmos's costumes either. They strike me as garish.

Mothra's reflective pollen is a nice idea - and what do you know, it's actually pulled off pretty well.

I actually don't mind the title Godzilla and Mothra: the Battle For Earth. Sure, it sounds pretentious - but that's fitting for the movie.
(And if it helps differentiate from our beloved '64 classic, all the better.)

That's all for now. Good grief, what a stupid movie...

[Pkmatrix]

Huh...I could've sworn I'd posted this both here and TK. Ah well, better late than never!

Immediately after rewwatching GvKG back in August I rewatched GvM'92 for the first time in at least 10 years. Honestly, I wasn't really looking forward to it...I didn't have fond memories (I remember this being a seriously boring movie).

I was pleasantly surprised! It was better than I expected, really not all that worse than GvKG, although it still isn't anywhere near as good as Biollante. Unlike GvKG, the plot here was pretty straightforward and not buried in a tangle of science fiction concepts and Hollywood visual references. The main characters are actually fine, interesting enough, and do follow a nice character arc.

That said, the movie has as many (if not more) significant problems than GvKG did.

Firstly, this isn't a Godzilla movie, despite the title. Sure, he makes a couple cameos, but it doesn't really start to turn into a Godzilla movie until the third Act (starting from the volcano erupting). Even then, all he does is appear, fight the army, fight Mothra and Battra, and then the movie ends. After watching this one, I really want to go through every movie and count up the monster screen times - I suspect this one may have the shortest appearance of Godzilla in the whole series.

A much worse problem is that this movie suffers from is the same issue some accuse Biollante of: too many characters, many with no point. While Biollante does have a lot of characters, most serve SOME purpose to what's going on. Not the case in this movie. Every scene involving the characters in the Control Room could be cut, and SHOULD have been cut. They were pointless. The was no reason at all for Miki Saeguesa to be a character in this story (or in GvKG either, although at least she had SLIGHTLY more to do there). The evil CEO? The Professor? The Minister? A good chunk of these characters are only there help beat the really obnoxious "Corporations are Evil! Mankind is destroying the Earth!" theme the movie is trying (and failing) to engage the audience on.

Worst of all, like GvKG, this movie doesn't have a third act for its characters - if anything, it's worse about it, since at least some characters had something to do in GvKG. In GvM'92, the plot really ends with the Hotel sequence - while a lot happens after that, none of it is of significance to the characters, all of whom are standing around and watching the monsters duke it out. Some may say this is a "good" thing because it means more monster action, but IMO this is VERY BAD writing and a serious failing on the part of the movie. If your characters aren't going to be important for the WHOLE story, then what was the point of focusing on them? Your characters have to be integral to what's going on from beginning to end. The original Mothra vs. Godzilla suffers from a similar problem, but at least makes up for it by inventing a new secondary plot for the characters to engage in (rescuing the schoolchildren form the island) and GvKG at least has Emi (the only main character given something to do) take over as protagonist for Act 3. No wonder I got so bored when, in theory, the movie was supposed to be getting more exciting! I think this movie would be much more fondly remembered (and liked) if Omori had come up with something, ANYTHING, for his characters to do at the end here.

On the FX side, the quality seems to be continuing its slow slide from the peak in the '80s. On the plus side, the volcano sequence is EXCELLENT. It's so good, and such a large step above everything else FX-wise here, that I'm left wondering if Kawakita asked Omori to write in the scene because he was dissatisfied with the "Godzilla emerges from a volcano" scene from Biollante and wanted to give it a second try. Mothra's Egg, the Cosmos, and the more action/adventure effects are also rather well-done - make fun of the Indiana Jones stuff, at least it was fun to watch and didn't look awful despite how blatantly obvious the references were. Battra, both larval and imago, has a cool design, too. Unfortunately, that's about where my praise ends. Godzilla, while retaining the same basic design philosophy as the previous two movies, looks...downgraded? The animatronic face certainly doesn't look as good as in the previous two movies. Battra, despite the cool design, is practically immobile - ESPECIALLY in the larval form. He's practically a statue! Mothra and Battra's imago forms are more mobile, but aren't much more effective. Many of the miniature FX, especially the military vehicles and in Mothra's attack on Tokyo, look...outdated. Not that they're necessarily bad, but unlike the miniature FX in the '80s (or even in GvKG, mostly) they look almost like stock footage from a movie 20 or 30 years older. What happened? To cover it, the movie makes even more use of showing the monster walking behind a matte of a real city. It's not really all that effective, and really draws attention to itself in the way it's used. The FX here are disappointing not just because I know Kawakita can do better, but because he demonstrates it within the same movie!

After all is said and done, though, I'd say it's about on par with GvKG. Decent, not necessarily something I'm going to be inclined to rewatch much but also not as godawful as some suggest. After rewatching this it's baffling that THIS is the highest grossing Godzilla movie in Japan (excepting Z'98, of course). Why? I don't get it. Sure, it's got Mothra in it, but was she really THAT popular that she could inflate the box office that much?

[Dr Kain]

In 1964, Toho released what is still considered to be the greatest Godzilla movie of the entire Showa era of the series. Some even proclaim it as the greatest Godzilla movie of all time. As such, it was only a matter of time before Mothra would show up once the series had been rebooted in the 80’s, especially with 1991’s “Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah” bringing back Godzilla’s deadliest foe. It did not take Toho very much to make this decision as Mothra was called back in to be Ghidorah’s successor when it came to battling Godzilla. Will Toho’s magic with Mothra strike again?

Unfortunately not. There is so much potential this movie had going for it, and instead, it just feels like it was made as a quick cash grab more than anything else. The plot revolves around a dead beat criminal father who is arrested for tomb raiding and forced to work with his ex-wife and is given the choice to help her explore Infant Island or spend the next fifty years in prison. They explore Infant Island where they meet the fairy twins, known as the Cosmos here, and Mothra’s egg. On the way to taking the egg to Japan, Godzilla attacks, as does a new monster by the name of Battra. Mothra hatches and escapes while Godzilla and Battra disappear with an eruption beneath the sea. The Cosmos are kidnapped by a big evil corporation, only to be rescued by Takaya so he can sell them to the Americans. In the meantime, Mothra comes looking for them, laying waste to Japan in the process, and when she is informed that the Cosmos are safe, she cocoons up in order to evolve into her moth form. Godzilla and Battra return, Mothra grows into her adult form, and a three way battle ensues.

This plot is mediocre at best, but the worst atrocity is how lazy it is. It feels like Toho just decided to rip off “Mothra,” “Mothra vs. Godzilla,” and even “King Kong vs. Godzilla” with this plot. There is an evil corporation that serves no purpose, but we are shown they are destroying a forest despite protest and they want to own the Cosmos for money. We have Mothra’s egg being carried by the boat in a similar style to how King Kong was being brought to Japan. And that is just a small part of the similarities between all three movies. It also does not help that the characters of the movie are either all scumbags or idiots. Takaya is a criminal, a liar, a cheat, he steals the Cosmos so he can sell them to someone else for his own gain, and then we are supposed to believe he is instantly changed the moment he hears his daughter mention his thievery. Then we have Ando, who kidnaps the Cosmos initially to help his boss make a lot of money who then just changes his mind the moment Godzilla attacks. WHAT?! Finally, there is Masako, Takaya’s ex-wife, who is an utter moron. There are a few other characters, but they are pretty much wallpaper for this movie, especially Miki, as they do nothing but stand around, talk, and then watch TV.

It also does not help things that from a story point of view, this movie is the odd one out of the Heisei series. “Godzilla 84,” “Godzilla vs. Biollante,” and “Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah” are able to work very well with each other, and due to how the events play out, they can kind of be considered a trilogy as they all focus on Godzilla’s return and we learn of how Godzilla came back to attack Japan in 1984. The movies that come after this can be deemed the “Godzilla Force Trilogy,” as they all deal with the Godzilla Force and their technological achievements to battle Godzilla. This one, however, just feels out of place as it is a standalone story suck in the middle of two overarching storylines, and nothing really comes out of this movie. Sure, we get to know what Mothra is doing in a future movie, but it has no impact on the plot of that movie whatsoever, nor do the events of this movie have any impact on the future stories either.

Plot aside, the monsters involved in this movie are Godzilla, Mothra, and Battra. Unfortunately, not even the monster costumes are immune to this movie’s flaws. Godzilla is fine for the most part, but his neck and face just seem off for some reason. I’m not really sure what it is, but they just feel lifeless as if the designers forgot to put the animatronics inside Godzilla’s face as his eyes just seem to have this dead stare, and not in a positive manner. Mothra looks similar to her Showa design outside of colors, but she has one major flaw, her wingspan is just too small. One of the things that made the original Mothra looks so incredible was the size of her body. Maybe this version has a bigger body compared to the original, but the wings just look way too small here. Battra is brand new, so there is no previous version to base his design off of, but his wings also look like they would be better bigger. His overall design is fantastic though as he looks just like what he is supposed to be, an evil version of Mothra. Unfortunately, I cannot say anything positive regarding the movements of Mothra and Battra, especially their larvae forms. When Mothra is destroying the city as a caterpillar, she looks like she is just on a railroad track or something, as she does not appear to be walking or crawling at all. It is like she is just being pulled and it really makes it boring to watch. If there is one thing I should not be when a monster is attacking a city, it is being bored. Battra’s larva form seems to have the same issue, but they did a lot better job of hiding it. Unfortunately, the issues do not stop there. Even their adult forms are handled slothfully. While it is nice to see the monsters’ wings flap, it does not look like they are no flapping because they need to in order to fly, but rather, they are flapping because Toho needed them to flap. It just looks so fake. Finally, the final battle of the movie looks pretty, but the two moths do nothing but shoot at Godzilla, and when they try to ram him, they are tossed as if they really are just rubber. While I understand it is hard to make a fight between a moth and a dinosaur exciting, at least the original movie from the 60’s had Mothra clawing at Godzilla on top of his head with her little feet. Nothing of the sort is featured here. On the positive side, the scene when Godzilla is arising from the volcano is downright incredible.

Overall, there is a lot wrong with “Godzilla vs. Mothra,” and I feel ashamed because some of it I never noticed until now. It is not even close to being the worst Godzilla movie ever, but as far as the Heisei series goes, this might actually be the weakest. Its plot has no bearing on its predecessors or successors, it feels like the writers just stitched scenes from previous movies together, and the monster attacks are not even all that entertaining at times. Battra is ultimately the saving grace of this movie, and he alone is the reason I give this movie a 4/10.

[Hybrid Gojira]

Yeah, I loathe this movie. I go back and forth between this and GvsSG for worst Heisei film. I do like Battra, but the effects are lazy outside of all the beams and the story is just bad compared to the Mothra vs. Godzilla. I HATE HATE HATE the beam noise they created for Godzilla's ray and the water scenes do no justice to his suit. You can clearly see the neck buckle and it looks like rubber.

[Dr Kain]

Yeah, I loathe this movie. I go back and forth between this and GvsSG for worst Heisei film. I do like Battra, but the effects are lazy outside of all the beams and the story is just bad compared to the Mothra vs. Godzilla. I HATE HATE HATE the beam noise they created for Godzilla's ray and the water scenes do no justice to his suit. You can clearly see the neck buckle and it looks like rubber.

Even without comparing it to Mothra vs Godzilla the story is bad. Whether or not I still hate Space G more will be determined at a later time when I get to watching that one again. Thankfully the next movie in the series is my second favorite.

[Hybrid Gojira]

Yeah, I loathe this movie. I go back and forth between this and GvsSG for worst Heisei film. I do like Battra, but the effects are lazy outside of all the beams and the story is just bad compared to the Mothra vs. Godzilla. I HATE HATE HATE the beam noise they created for Godzilla's ray and the water scenes do no justice to his suit. You can clearly see the neck buckle and it looks like rubber.

Even without comparing it to Mothra vs Godzilla the story is bad. Whether or not I still hate Space G more will be determined at a later time when I get to watching that one again. Thankfully the next movie in the series is my second favorite.

Yeah, Space Godzilla is terrible... it's just boring. I recall almost falling asleep during my first viewing of it.

[Dr Kain]

Yeah, I loathe this movie. I go back and forth between this and GvsSG for worst Heisei film. I do like Battra, but the effects are lazy outside of all the beams and the story is just bad compared to the Mothra vs. Godzilla. I HATE HATE HATE the beam noise they created for Godzilla's ray and the water scenes do no justice to his suit. You can clearly see the neck buckle and it looks like rubber.

Even without comparing it to Mothra vs Godzilla the story is bad. Whether or not I still hate Space G more will be determined at a later time when I get to watching that one again. Thankfully the next movie in the series is my second favorite.

Yeah, Space Godzilla is terrible... it's just boring. I recall almost falling asleep during my first viewing of it.

Man, I remember being so excited when Media Play had the new tapes in and i was starring at both SG and D wondering which to buy. Since I had the SpaceG figure from Trendmasters for the last few years though, I thought it was an easy choice and bought that movie thinking it was going to be nothing short of amazing. Man was I wrong and wished I had bought Destoroyah instead.

[jellydonut25]

Worse acting than a Troma film! Poorer effects sequences than Superman IV! More singing than The Hobbit! This film has it all that I hate!

The random card draw giveth and the random card draw....maybe not "taketh away" but certainly at least "giveth garbage"

This movie is insufferable. From the Indiana Jones ripoffs, to the cold, sterile, robotic sound of the beams...

The acting is brutal in any language, the characters blaming direct consequences of a meteor strike on humanity's hubris is awful, the constant singing is absolutely brutal, and if not for Battra and the volcano sequence there'd almost as literally as I could think be nothing good about this movie. And I really only personally like larva Battra...

Juxtaposing this alongside a recent re-watch of Mothra vs. Godzilla, BY PURE RANDOM DRAW NO LESS(!) exposed even more flaws than I had previously noticed for example:
In Mothra vs. Godzilla, the Shobijin want the egg returned to their island so Mothra doesn't accidentally destroy a city. Here, they're like "Yes, we will go with you to Japan, bring Mothra's egg and there we can spread the message of Mothra!" (Yes! Bring us and our raging deathworm to your cities of millions!)
In Mothra vs. Godzilla, our two greedy businessmen who try to kidnap the Shobijin and exploit Mothra's egg get their comeuppance. Kumayama gets shot during a tussle with Torohata and Torohata gets squashed by Godzilla. Here, ther's no satisfying end to the villain's story. Ando just quits working for his company. Oooh you really showed him! Now he'll have to find someone else to spend the insurance money from his destroyed projects and a new company man to help count all the money from the reconstruction!
Also noticed a dorsal plate gap in the suit during the volcano sequence.

It's been a while since I watched the original Mothra, so I can't recall, but is the cocoon sequence as ridiculously gratuitous as it is here? Mothra's shooting out her sticky white stuff for like 10 minutes.

This movie SUCKS.

[Jorzilla]

Rather than further pollute the Rank the Heisei Series thread, I just want to point out that Godzilla serves no purpose in this film.

The conflict is between Mothra and Battra, Godzilla just kind of shows up when it's convenient to move the plot forward. He literally could have been any other monster (and was, originally this was supposed to be Bagan).

Oh, the Mothra egg is being towed, without defense? Godzilla shows up.

He's not convenient to the plot any more?

A volcano eats him.

Oh, Mothra and Battra fighting is rather dull? Godzilla gets vomited back out of the Earth.

[lhb412]

This is gonna hurt when I get those Blu-Rays next week. What do you guys recommend for decreasing the pain of this movie? Horse tranquilizers?

[jellydonut25]

This is gonna hurt when I get those Blu-Rays next week. What do you guys recommend for decreasing the pain of this movie? Horse tranquilizers?

self-flagellation.

[XvGojira]

Rather than further pollute the Rank the Heisei Series thread, I just want to point out that Godzilla serves no purpose in this film.

The conflict is between Mothra and Battra, Godzilla just kind of shows up when it's convenient to move the plot forward. He literally could have been any other monster (and was, originally this was supposed to be Bagan).

Oh, the Mothra egg is being towed, without defense? Godzilla shows up.

He's not convenient to the plot any more?

A volcano eats him.

Oh, Mothra and Battra fighting is rather dull? Godzilla gets vomited back out of the Earth.

So he's like Indiana Jones in Raiders of the Lost Arc, but less fun and exciting?

[CWSmith]

This is gonna hurt when I get those Blu-Rays next week. What do you guys recommend for decreasing the pain of this movie? Horse tranquilizers?

Me and a buddy of mine made it through the movie a few years ago with a copious amount of whiskey.

I have a harder time making it through this movie when I do my annual rewatch of the whole series than ANY of the others. Most of the reasons have already been stated (Godzilla is not even required for the plot, unlikable human characters, the worst effects of the Heisei films, etc.), but I have some others to add too. To me, this was the original "Let's all stand around and stare at the monsters fighting" movie in the series, a bad habit that annoyed me in the later Heisei movies too.

Literally the only redeeming factor for me is the ridiculous scene where the two government guys press a button to spin themselves like 8 ft around to see the monitor better. Its played as an epic moment and it makes me laugh every time.

[MekaGojira3k]

I love when the viewing area goes into BATTLE MODE.

[MekaGojira3k]

Watched this last night, and I think the thing that irks me most about this Mothra is how lifeless it is. When the larva is crawling down the street its head slowly moves up and then down unlike the rapid movements of the Mothra Larva in things like Mothra vs. Godzilla. It just seems so slowed down to the point it looks weird. The less said about the adult Mothra the better.

[jellydonut25]

Worst Mothra ever.

[MekaGojira3k]

Worst Mothra ever.

Yeah. I even prefer Mothra Leo to this thing. Leo was very plush toy but he had a cool color scheme.

[Hybrid Gojira]

This movie sucks.

And that's being...constructive on my part. It's unabashedly horrible.

[DannyBeane]

Worst Mothra ever.

Yeah. I even prefer Mothra Leo to this thing. Leo was very plush toy but he had a cool color scheme.

Leo was awesome (beaminess aside) his movies were just terrible.

[H-Man]

The same Mothra prop from this film looked better in Rebirth of Mothra.

[MekaGojira3k]

I really like Battra's theme and design.

That's as positive as I can get about this thing. Battra.

[DannyBeane]

Its been a few years since I've seen this film. This film is in my bottom 5 Godzilla movies however after watching the blu ray, it wasn't as bad as I remembered. The Mothra prop still looked like it was made of materials you would find in a Hobby Lobby. The beam wars are ridiculous. The Indiana Jones knockoff with a mullet is also annoying and this movie has some of the worst matte shots/composite shots in the series.

That said there was some pretty cool stuff I can appreciate. Larva Battra is badass. I'd wish they would bring him back if they ever rebooted Mothra. The Imago form was a little bit of a disappointment though. The Battle between Larval Battra and Godzilla was also really well done. Watching the two fight on the ocean floor was brutal and a nice change of pace from in the city/countryside. Godzilla's entrance from Mount Fuji was also probably one of his best appearances in the Heisei series, right up there with his Hong Kong entrance in Destroyah and his entrance from Mount Mihara in Biollante. Godzilla needs to come out of more exploding volcanoes damnit! Also Mothra and Battra mending their relationship did stir up a few emotions from me.

Overall this movie had a lot of potential but suffers from a shoddy script and poor spfx work. This felt more like a Rebirth of Mothra movie with a Godzilla cameo.