TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby jellydonut25 » Thu Apr 10, 2014 8:37 am

This was a semi-recent rewatch (I just forgot to post in here that I'd watched it).

I almost like this movie better as a sort of distantified sequel to GxMG. Every time I've ever watched it prior to this, it was almost directly on the heels of GxMG, and this was the first time I felt myself enjoying a large portion of the film. It still irritates me that they basically didn't bring back any of the characters, I find some of the editing of the battle jarring, and I think it's pretty lame how Godzilla walked away after a point-blank blast from the Absolute Zero cannon but couldn't hold up against a drill, but I find enough in the movie to enjoy to mostly have a decent time watching this one.

Not the most ringing endorsement, I know...it's just a very middle-of-the-road film for me...
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby MekaGojira3k » Thu Apr 10, 2014 9:38 am

It would have been great to bring back Akane and have her pilot Kiryu. On the other hand, it's interesting (vaguely) to focus on a MechaGodzilla technician. I still like this movie more than X MechaGodzilla even if that film is more competently put together.
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby Jorzilla » Thu Apr 10, 2014 8:09 pm

I always felt that they tied up the old pilots nicely. Sure the excuse is a little lame, but Akane has dialog and basically patches the narrative torch to Chujo. I also really like that the person she had the most problems with in the first movie (the brother of the commander she accidentally let Godzilla kill), is the one who's most friendly to her.

I thought it was a nice send off, and basically a way of sending in the new team who's taking over while Kiryu was undergoing repairs. To that extent, it makes sense that they might send them to train up more since Godzilla was not an immediate threat at that point.

This is one of those films that's an easy target for the "not another Mechagodzilla and Mothra movie!!!" crowd. I really do like that Tezuka has a real passion for the franchise, and threw in some awesome references and remade some great scenes with a modern twist. The special effects are great and Kiryu is one of the best "new" monsters of the Godzilla franchise.

The editing could use a little more work and the writing is confusing or not well thought. The premise is awesome. I've consistently seen this movie rise in ranks for favorite films, while I've seen GMK fall.
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby MekaGojira3k » Fri Apr 11, 2014 8:46 am

I don't mind the Mothra and MechaGodzilla aspect, mostly because they've never shared a film before. I kind of wish they had interacted a bit though. The film used to be a top 10 favorite for me, but its slid back a lot since the summer of 2004. Most of it is just the fact that Tezuka tells the same-ish story for the third time. I still enjoy the film though. If nothing else it has the best Mothra ever.
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby klen7 » Fri Apr 11, 2014 9:33 am

MekaGojira3k wrote:If nothing else it has the best Mothra ever.
1961 called. It just wanted to let you know that you were wrong :P
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby MekaGojira3k » Fri Apr 11, 2014 11:08 am

klen7 wrote:
MekaGojira3k wrote:If nothing else it has the best Mothra ever.
1961 called. It just wanted to let you know that you were wrong :P

I used to think that was the best, but the legs on the 03' Mothra just look better to me.
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby jellydonut25 » Fri Apr 11, 2014 1:17 pm

I don't SO MUCH care that we lose our main characters from the previous film...more that none of their replacements are even remotely adequate, and if we were already gonna get ridiculously sub-par characterization, we should have had it just be with our pre-existing group of characters, so that we already know some stuff about them, so that we care without getting good characterization.
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby MekaGojira3k » Fri Apr 11, 2014 3:16 pm

I dunno, the characterization isn't....awful...it still feels more present than in the 90s Heisei films and the inclusion of Hiroshi Koizumi as Chujo is useful. I think, when I look back at this film, my biggest problem is the story-arc. It feels like it's just X MechaGodzilla 2 + bits of Mothra and Mothra vs. Godzilla. That's actually okay, because they feel less grating here (probably because of competent effects work) than in Godzilla vs. Mothra.

I think a more effective means of involving Mothra would be to have Kiryu actively seeking out kaiju threats, Mothra being one of them. It just seems sturdier than LEAVE DEM DEAD MONSTER BONES ALONE! Maybe my idea is just as lame. It's just bothersome that Mothra didn't give a crap about Godzilla's skeleton from 1999-2003, it was only after the events of the movie that it was all "HEY WAIT. BALANCE OF LIFE...OR SOMETHING..."

I'm also tired of the character Tezuka always relies on which is the "I DON'T CONNECT WIT PEOPLE AND I'M INVOLVED IN FIGHTING GODZILLER."
By the third film it's time to switch things up.
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby jellydonut25 » Fri Apr 11, 2014 4:22 pm

^The bones storyline is pretty lame, agreed...not because it's lame on the face of it, but because it amounts to nothing. At least in Mothra vs. Godzilla there's a scene where Mothra (via the fairies) has to be convinced to help. In this film, the Shobijn are all "Mothra won't help you if you use Mechagodzilla" and then Mothra's all, "Nah...I totes will help"
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby Reaper G » Sat Apr 12, 2014 11:05 am

MekaGojira3k wrote:I don't mind the Mothra and MechaGodzilla aspect, mostly because they've never shared a film before. I kind of wish they had interacted a bit though. The film used to be a top 10 favorite for me, but its slid back a lot since the summer of 2004. Most of it is just the fact that Tezuka tells the same-ish story for the third time. I still enjoy the film though. If nothing else it has the best Mothra ever.


That's why this is my least favorite of the Millenium films. Mothra vs. Mechagodzilla would've been new; instead, we got rehashes from several previous Toho monster flicks.
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby davezilla » Mon May 12, 2014 8:28 pm

I love Tokyo SOS. My fav probably of Millenium series. It's interesting that it's a sequel really to a couple of films. Godzilla against MechaGodzilla and the original Mothra. I love the interaction between the fairies and Chujo. I love the idea of them telling humanity that they made a mistake harvesting the bones of the original Godzilla. I wish this idea had been taken even further. This could of been a very dark film.

Mothra, what can I say but director Tezuka really REALLY got Mothra right in this film. The battle between the adult Mothra and Godzilla is heart wrenching. I guess I forget sometimes how much I love the big moth. I feel terrible when it gets injured. And it takes a beating in this film and still keeps on going. I also like the idea of the larva getting angry when their mother is killed.

I've said it once and I'll say it again. I love this Godzilla suit and design. Very expressive. I also enjoy Kiryu a lot as well. A nice balance between the two previous MGs in design.

The score is fantastic, the cast is nice (it's really nice to see Hiroshi Koizumi again in a G flick), the pacing I think is good although I always feel like it's an incredibly short film. I just love it for some reason.

I seriously need the soundtrack to this flick!!!!
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby MekaGojira3k » Tue May 13, 2014 1:40 pm

The excellent Mothra in this movie is probably 40% of the reason I like it so much. The kaiju are all so well done here, but Mothra is the best. It had been nearly 40 years since there had been a Mothra of any quality on screen, so that probably adds to it.
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby Hybrid Gojira » Tue May 13, 2014 2:06 pm

MekaGojira3k wrote:The excellent Mothra in this movie is probably 40% of the reason I like it so much. The kaiju are all so well done here, but Mothra is the best. It had been nearly 40 years since there had been a Mothra of any quality on screen, so that probably adds to it.



Yep - Mothra is awesome in this movie.
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby Gojilove » Wed May 14, 2014 4:34 pm

Unfortunately the design and execution of Mothra is one of the only redeeming qualities about this film for me.
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby goji4ever » Fri Jun 06, 2014 12:56 pm

Solid but pretty by the numbers entry...effects are overall very solid..movie has several choice money shots...has one of the weakest Godzillas though...Godzilla the big bully comes out the water and has everyone jump and beat him down.
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby Jorzilla » Mon Jun 09, 2014 3:13 pm

goji4ever wrote:Solid but pretty by the numbers entry...effects are overall very solid..movie has several choice money shots...has one of the weakest Godzillas though...Godzilla the big bully comes out the water and has everyone jump and beat him down.


I actually like this about Godzilla. He might be the existential threat of the film, but he's not the primary narrative. Now, this could have been improved on A LOT, but it really is the governments decision to use Mechagodzilla and Mechagodzilla's movie. Godzilla really is more of a 'force of nature' in this film. He's not necessarily malicious, but he's not good either. He has to be stopped at any cost, even if that means using Mechagodzilla who has all of those problems going rogue, and the Shobijin's opposition to MG.

As Godzilla is not really at fault in this movie (being attracted to MG), he's just a bystander in the film. He gets a lot of good shots in, and is a vicious fighter. However, at the end of the day, when Mechagodzilla is about to deliver the death blow, you actually feel sympathy for Godzilla! This is some pretty good film making, in my opinion.

I would LOVE to see a Legendary movie use some of these elements. The catch-22 of using Mechagodzilla in particular, is a pretty interesting plot device.
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby goji4ever » Mon Jun 09, 2014 6:35 pm

I see the Peter Pan problem with this film... If Godzilla is terrible and overwhelming then the cooperation of Mothra and Kiryu becomes something we root for..
As it stands the "bad guy" is seriously overwhelmed thus lessening the impact of their victory.. A more vulnerable godzilla isnt bad at all, unfortunately he was too weak..he needed to get a few more shots in, the heroes needed to snatch victory from the edge of defeat and I feel that didnt happen...it robbed kiryu of his glory.
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby Jorzilla » Mon Jun 09, 2014 7:15 pm

Godzilla managed to kill Mothra and knock Mechagodzilla out of commission. The end of the film relies on Godzilla getting his ass kicked, and Mechagodzilla becoming sentient one more time to stop humans from killing Godzilla. Godzilla was a victim of the circumstance, and only appeared because Japan built MG in the first place. The end closes the loop on this thread by returning both of the monsters to sea.

This is literally the first time I've ever seen anyone describe this Godzilla as 'too weak.'
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby goji4ever » Sat Jun 14, 2014 12:45 am

mayhaps the fall of Mothra doesnt have impact because its such a predictable routine by this point...
As soon as the egg hatches you know adult mothra is toast and that despite being seemingly outmatched you automatically know the larvae are in no danger of getting beaten around....Kyriu going down is not so much a function of how badass godzilla is as much as a function of the plot to get characters where they need to be..From the moment the larvae begin fighting and Kyriu rises again the battle feels lost for godzilla and the beatdown seems to go on seemingly forever...

Perhaps it has the same problem that Goji vs Mechagodzilla II had in that you dont know who to root for...
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby Hybrid Gojira » Fri Sep 12, 2014 2:29 am

I just finished watching this (and I watched GxMG a few nights ago). It's an ok movie, but I actually liked the previous entry more.

There are some really cool ideas in this film. Throughout the movie, we get the "life should be lived in the time nature allows" bit with references to other mistakes man has made (aka creating Godzilla). We never learn, and to his credit Tezuka wraps the series up by demonstrating that very idea by using the Godzilla DNA scene at the end. It was a stroke of genius and honestly made me crave another film. The score is excellent and is one of my favorite parts of the movie. There some very cool sequences during the fights - Godzilla trips Kiryu and then blasts his face off; the death of Mothra; Kiryu shooting missiles from every direction around the Diet Building. There are tons and tons of buildings that are wrecked, toppled, and crashed through. That said, some of the editing is horrendous. Mothra grabs Godzilla and flies, hurling him down the street, except in one scene he is upright and in the very next frame he is sliding head-first. Godzilla beams Kiryu, destroying his eye, but Kiryu's body is facing the wrong direction one frame later as he crashes to the ground. It's extremely distracting. GxMG had similar issues.

Random thoughts:

I think dropping Akane was a terrible plot choice considering she's still in the film. The new cast is ok, but also feels rehashed. There's no development between Azusa and Chujo's relationship other than a funny line about him only being interested in machines. Kiryu is down for months and they can't properly repair him, but he is fixed within minutes during the the final battle... Hmm. Godzilla's portrayal in this movie irks me. He's boring and lacks expressiveness. The film has uneven effects. As I mentioned before in the GxMG thread, the miniatures here look great sometimes but really lack that color palate to make it suspend my belief. Having just watched MZ, I can tell you that film does a better job with blending the real life scenes with the effects than this movie does. I also found the battle in GxMG to be more entertaining compared to GSOS. Mothra looks great, but some of the matte shots are simply poor.

Overall...I do like this film but it's a middling G flick.
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby jellydonut25 » Fri Sep 12, 2014 12:20 pm

^I've said it before and I'll say it again: they could have given us the EXACT same movie (almost) but with the cast from the original instead of all these new people, and the movie would instantly be better.
There's a massive lack of character development in this movie...which is okay if you bring back a cast of characters we've already come to know, but it's not okay with all these new people we don't care about at all.
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby Hybrid Gojira » Fri Sep 12, 2014 3:11 pm

jellydonut25 wrote:^I've said it before and I'll say it again: they could have given us the EXACT same movie (almost) but with the cast from the original instead of all these new people, and the movie would instantly be better.
There's a massive lack of character development in this movie...which is okay if you bring back a cast of characters we've already come to know, but it's not okay with all these new people we don't care about at all.



I totally agree. Also, exactly how much sense does it make to take your best pilot and send her to train and then replace her with anyone else? She's the only person with combat experience, but then I suppose this is a Godzilla movie. In retrospect, it was a bad move to send off the one person who actually understood Kiryu...and it would have made more sense given how the film ended. I still like this movie, but it's not great. Oddly enough, the worst part of this film for me was Godzilla. I cannot stand the way he moves.
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby kiryugoji04 » Fri Mar 27, 2015 3:24 am

I rewatched this today. It still exists. As a tokusatsu FX reel, I think it's fantastic. All the miniature work is on point and I wish Asada had gotten to work on more kaiju films apart from Final Wars and this.

As anything else, this movie is pretty bland. Bleah.
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby Dr Kain » Fri Mar 27, 2015 9:28 am

I definitely can not even remotely agree with you there. In fact, I think this movie gets more hate than it deserves as I think it one of the best Godzilla movies of all time. Yeah, it takes some missteps, but that hardly affects the quality of the movie overall. It stars someone who is not a soldier, scientist, or reporter, he is an engineer, and it has Chujo from Mothra in it, it has homages to Mothra vs Godzilla, it continues on the story of Kiryu and concludes it, the monster battles are utterly fantastic, Godzilla is magnificent, and overall, it is just an enjoyable movie. I think it could have benefited from being 15 minutes longer, but oh well.
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Re: TALKBACK #27: Godzilla Tokyo SOS

Postby MekaGojira3k » Fri Mar 27, 2015 10:29 am

I kind of agree with Jared, but I'd mention the score as a highlight as well.
I wish this and X MechaGodzilla could make a baby and we'd have a much better Tezuka film overall.
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