Composers of Final Wars and Music Discussion

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Composers of Final Wars and Music Discussion

Postby Benjamin Haines » Sat Sep 15, 2007 7:01 pm

There's one thing I've been wondering that I'm really curious to know. Keith Emerson, Nobuhiko Morino, and Daisuke Yano were the three composers for Final Wars, but I don't know who composed what. I know for certain that Yano did the new theme for Godzilla (King of the Monsters), and that Emerson did the Ending Title theme (supposedly it was a piece he had originally done on his own and wasn't produced specifically for this film). But I haven't got a clue about the rest. Can anybody fill me in here?

Also, feel free to use this topic to discuss the music of Final Wars in general. What did you think of it? I myself would normally be turned away by the prospect of a mostly-synth score, and when I first listened to the soundtrack before seeing the movie I was indeed taken aback by it considerably. It didn't seem "bad" per se, just so completely out of left field and mixed-up that I couldn't imagine it working, even for a Kitamura film. But once I saw it, it seemed fine. Now, as I'm getting back into the film and contemplating it more, I've realized that the music for this flick really fits it down to a tee. Every piece works perfectly for every scene it's used in, every cue hits the mark exactly as it should. And aside from that, I think it's a very catchy score overall. It may not be complex or awe-inspiring like an orchestral work, and it was clearly all done with computers and synthesizers, but whenever I'm in the mood to hear something of this type, this score is most definitely the best of this type.

One thing that does puzzle me though is why the soundtrack album isn't complete. There are several themes heard throughout the film, some of them among the best of the entire score, which are definitely not present on the soundtrack. Likewise, the soundtrack includes six tracks which never made it into the finished film, a few of them being synthesized remixes of Ifukube themes. I can understand why these tracks went unused, as there simply wasn't any place in the movie where they were needed. But why several great themes from the actual movie went left off from the soundtrack is just baffling.
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Postby Dogora » Sat Sep 15, 2007 7:07 pm

I hated it. Ifukube Forever!
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Postby MouthForWar » Sat Sep 15, 2007 7:37 pm

I love Final Wars.... I know its not a "GOOD" film per say, but its a great time and it has plenty of homages to past Godzilla and Toho sci fi films that are a lot of fun. Its a cheesy 70s style Godzilla movie lensed through a modern filter. I think its great... but I also love Godzilla vs. Gigan, so what do I know?

As for the music, I dig Keith Emerson's stuff (such as his soundtrack for Argento's Inferno) so I didn't have a problem with the music. Emerson is one of the best keyboardists that ever lived and he's a prog-rock legend. I couldn't imagine any OTHER music in GFW because its the only music that I can imagine fitting with this weird movie.

Anyway, to answer your questions about who did what:

http://www.godzillamonstermusic.com/VICP62936.htm

But I didn't notice any themes in the movie that aren't on the soundtrack :?
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Postby Benjamin Haines » Sat Sep 15, 2007 7:56 pm

MouthForWar wrote:Anyway, to answer your questions about who did what:

http://www.godzillamonstermusic.com/VICP62936.htm


Thanks!

MouthForWar wrote:But I didn't notice any themes in the movie that aren't on the soundtrack :?


The version of "King of the Monsters" that begins at the start on the New Guinea/Kumonga scene and continues through the Kamacuras slaughter is significantly different from the one used at the beginning of the film. In my opinion, it's even better, and I was disappointed to find that the soundtrack was lacking it.

The theme that plays when Gigan awakens and all of the monsters are unleashed back on the world is a pumped-up, high-energy version of "Arrival", and it's absent from the soundtrack.

There are three versions of "Kazama's Sacrifice" in the film. The first one plays during the Ebirah vs. the mutants fight at the energy plant and lacks the main synthesizers of the later two. The second plays when the Gotengo takes off to head for the south pole, and is basically like the third version but with more of an electronic sound to it. The third version, which plays when Kazama makes his run on the Mothership, is the only version of the theme on the soundtrack.

The theme that plays when Godzilla destroys the meteor containing Monster X, which seems to be original and not a remix of any other pieces in the film, is just flat-out not there on the soundtrack.

Finally, the piece heard when Minilla stops Godzilla from killing the heroes, another original-sounding theme, isn't on the soundtrack either.

There may have been others which I'm not remembering at the moment. Most of them seem to have been alternate versions of themes used elsewhere in the movie. I guess I can see why the soundtrack album's producers made the decision not to include them, but I really don't agree with it. A film's soundtrack should include every bit of music in the movie, even alternate themes. It's especially puzzling that they would include pieces that weren't used in the movie but leave out themes that were.
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Postby Legacy_Of_Gamera » Sat Sep 15, 2007 8:55 pm

You are forgetting the Monster X transformation and Godzilla vs. Kaiser Ghidorah themes. Both of those were really good compared to most of the music from FW. Yet both are missing from the OST.
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Postby Andrew Nguyen » Sat Sep 15, 2007 9:41 pm

The music is alright but sometimes its just seems so embarrasing to listen to and to hear it while watching the movie since it just goes to push even further the idea that Final Wars was a disaster.

The best example I could think of is that song that they used when they were at the oil factory fighting Ebirah and when the Gotengo charges the mothership head on and all that.


As for the Godzilla theme used, well it seems to show that Godzilla is literally having a party instead of showing the fact that he is an incredibly-nigh lethal killing machine.


I have to admit though that when all of the other monsters were blasting their way through the cities of the world that they did use some good music for that one.
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Re: Composers of Final Wars and Music Discussion

Postby Baradagi » Sun Sep 16, 2007 2:13 am

I've always loved the score for G:FW, mainly the stuff done by Nobuhiko Morino and Daisuke Yano. Most of the Keith Emerson pieces range from okay (Manda vs Gotengo) to cringe worthy (Ending Title). I believe Emerson's music was recycled from an older LP release of his, which is why it seems completely out of place compared to the rest. The cold, impersonal feeling the synth-score gives fits well with the muted colors and futuristic/fascist look of the film.

Benjamin Haines wrote:One thing that does puzzle me though is why the soundtrack album isn't complete. There are several themes heard throughout the film, some of them among the best of the entire score, which are definitely not present on the soundtrack. Likewise, the soundtrack includes six tracks which never made it into the finished film, a few of them being synthesized remixes of Ifukube themes. I can understand why these tracks went unused, as there simply wasn't any place in the movie where they were needed. But why several great themes from the actual movie went left off from the soundtrack is just baffling.


Speaking of incomplete soundtracks, the soundtrack to VERSUS by Nobuhiko Morino is missing ALL of the best themes from the entire score heard during the final fight scenes. Some tracks are edited, and others are just alternate takes slightly different from the final film version. I was pretty pissed that the music heard when Tak Sakaguchi strikes the cool pose with two swords was completely edited out.

If anyone enjoys the score to G:FW, I would suggest tracking down the soundtrack to Kitamura's ALIVE, again done by Nobuhiko Morino and Daisuke Yano. They did a fantastic job re-creating the depressing cyberpunk atmosphere the film has. Luckily, this release contains the complete version of the soundtrack!
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Postby Benjamin Haines » Sun Sep 16, 2007 7:59 am

Legacy_Of_Gamera wrote:You are forgetting the Monster X transformation and Godzilla vs. Kaiser Ghidorah themes. Both of those were really good compared to most of the music from FW. Yet both are missing from the OST.


That's right. I think that was all one continuous theme actually.

There's also the piece that plays when Ozaki first meets Miyuki. Another is right after Godzilla kills Keizer Ghidorah and turns around to finish off the Gotengo, it plays a shorter, synthesized version of "King of the Monsters". There's also the short but notable cues that play when the Gotengo drills into the hull of the Mothership and during the few seconds in which the Shobijin summon Mothra. None of those are on the soundtrack.

I know it'll never happen, but I hope La-La Land Records take notice.
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Postby planetxleader » Sun Sep 16, 2007 8:36 am

Benjamin Haines wrote:The theme that plays when Gigan awakens and all of the monsters are unleashed back on the world is a pumped-up, high-energy version of "Arrival", and it's absent from the soundtrack.


:D Yes! I love that piece, especially when all the ships launch! Heavy guitar, and then badass Gigan marching through flame and smoke!
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Postby Tyler E. Martin » Sun Sep 16, 2007 2:49 pm

In all honesty, I find "Final Wars" to be a terrible, headache-inducing waste of time. I keep trying to give it another chance, but I just can't bring myself to like it. There really aren't many positive things I can say about it at all.

As far as the music is concerned, I was for the most part thoroughly disgusted. There are a couple of tracks that I enjoy. I don't normally go for "remixes," especially since Ifukube himself stated that he did not want his music used in such a style, but I can't help but enjoy "Beginning of the End." It's very catchy and using the original Godzilla theme as a hook makes the piece, I think. That and "Kazama's Sacrifice"--nice listening as well, in a video game sort of way. But the rest of it is mind-numbingly atrocious. I can go for some good techno every now and then, but the majority of the music for "Final Wars" just doesn't cut it for me. It's as inappropriate and insulting to Godzilla as the rest of the movie.

That's my two cents, anyway.
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Postby Legion » Sun Sep 16, 2007 2:56 pm

Gawdziller wrote:In all honesty, I find "Final Wars" to be a terrible, headache-inducing waste of time. I keep trying to give it another chance, but I just can't bring myself to like it. There really aren't many positive things I can say about it at all.

As far as the music is concerned, I was for the most part thoroughly disgusted. There are a couple of tracks that I enjoy. I don't normally go for "remixes," especially since Ifukube himself stated that he did not want his music used in such a style, but I can't help but enjoy "Beginning of the End." It's very catchy and using the original Godzilla theme as a hook makes the piece, I think. That and "Kazama's Sacrifice"--nice listening as well, in a video game sort of way. But the rest of it is mind-numbingly atrocious. I can go for some good techno every now and then, but the majority of the music for "Final Wars" just doesn't cut it for me. It's as inappropriate and insulting to Godzilla as the rest of the movie.

That's my two cents, anyway.


It may be your two cents but I agree with it.

There's actually one piece of music from Final Wars that I actually do like, and that's the Daisuke Yano Godzilla theme that plays at the beginning of the movie, during the fights with Kamakaras and Kumonga and during the final battle with Kaiser Ghidora.

Hmmm, I believe that track is called "The King of the Monsters".
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Postby gojira_fan » Sun Sep 16, 2007 4:12 pm

The music to FW was atrocious.

The end credits sounded like an old Nintendo video game.
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Postby dIsCoMbObuLaTor » Sat Sep 22, 2007 12:29 am

Well lets see here....

I have always liked Final Wars.....to a degree. I have a few Big problems with the movie, but I still find enough redeemable qualities in it. To warrant watching every once in awhile. I hate the fact that soooooooooo much time was spent on the human plot that it left little room for Godzilla to actually fight. That is actually my biggest problem with the movie. The fight between King Seeser, Rodan, Angruis, and Godzilla could have been epic had they not gave the humans so much screen time.

My other gripe with the movie....was actually the music. Don't get me wrong...I thought the music was pretty cool, and It would have made an interesting remix CD or something.....but when I see Godzilla rampaging across the horizon I want the classic orchestral music. It's something about the classic instrumental Godzilla theme that gets me pumped up. When I hear it I am ready to go punch a hole in a wall and kick a kitten across the yard.

The epic feeling that the original music creates is totally lost in the Synth stuff. It may be that so much of my childhood is tied to that classic music that I don't want to let go of it. But regardless, I still find that it improves the overall experience of the movie for me.
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Postby Benjamin Haines » Fri May 14, 2010 7:29 pm

Now that Toho have released the complete score to Final Wars, and with the help of iTunes, I've found just how the soundtrack is divided among the three composers.

Godzilla: Final Wars - music from the motion picture (minus stock cues) - 45 tracks - 1:47:56 runtime

    Keith Emerson - 15 tracks - 31:49 runtime
    Nobuhiko Morino - 17 tracks - 39:30 runtime
    Daisuke Yano - 13 tracks - 36:37 runtime

Any way you slice it, Morino has the most material on this soundtrack. Funnily, Emerson has more tracks than Yano but considerably less actual music. All in all though, for a soundtrack with three composers this is pretty balanced.
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Postby Robert Saint John » Sat May 15, 2010 12:24 am

Nice job, Ben! It's also worth noting that there are a number of repeats in those Emerson tracks on the Godzilla 50th Anniv box version.

Something else I brought up back in early 2005, but never dug into. I heard two of Emerson's tracks used as stock music, one for a radio commercial (Cruising the Cirro-Stratus) and one for a television commercial (High Battle). Since then, I've wondered how much of his music was even composed exclusively for GFW in the first place (similar to what Brad said above).
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Postby Benjamin Haines » Sat May 15, 2010 1:57 pm

mechascorpio wrote:Nice job, Ben! It's also worth noting that there are a number of repeats in those Emerson tracks on the Godzilla 50th Anniv box version.


Yeah. I probably should have mentioned that I only counted the tracks that were used in the movie in my analysis (all of the first disc and the first 13 tracks from the second disc). Almost all of the bonus tracks on the second and third discs are by Emerson.


mechascorpio wrote:Something else I brought up back in early 2005, but never dug into. I heard two of Emerson's tracks used as stock music, one for a radio commercial (Cruising the Cirro-Stratus) and one for a television commercial (High Battle). Since then, I've wondered how much of his music was even composed exclusively for GFW in the first place (similar to what Brad said above).


One of the 15 "Demo Music" tracks on the third disc is a very rough, unfinished demo version of "Highway Battle," so if it was a preexisting cue then it was at least refined to some degree for the movie.
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Postby jellydonut25 » Sun May 16, 2010 11:44 pm

never was a huge fan of Final Wars' score

well, more specifically, i just wasnt a fan of the "happy" music...

I really liked Gigan's theme a lot, tbh and the Godzilla theme is cool too
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Postby ebirahsmeg1 » Tue Jun 08, 2010 11:26 am

I really enjoyed GFW alot...not a perfect film by any means (though I found many of this film's biggest critics to be extremely prudish/yuppy-ish/prissy/hypocrital and over the top at times...but I'm not opening that can of worms again...to each their own, and the debate about this film became quit boring and pointless a long time ago), but for me personally, it restored alot of the fun and magic that had been missing from the beyond-description bordom of the Kiryu snoozefests that I endured the previous 2 films. When I saw it for the first time, it reminded me of my childhood days watching G films on TBS Super Scary Saturdays.

Having said that...I can't say I liked the soundtrack much AT ALL.

When Keith Emerson was announced as a composer, my reaction was initially very positive, despite it seeming to be an oddball choice. I felt his work for NightHawks to be one of the best, most underrated movie soundtracks of the 80s, and his rendition of "I'm a man" during the epic Stallone-Hauer staredown created an intense, amazing atmosphere unmatched in the action genre. I held him in high regards and looked forward to his unique take on a kaiju film's soundtrack...

...um...yeah...the rest you could say is history :? :cry: :-\ :th-dn: Needless to say, the final score was EXTREMELY disappointing.

I didn't hate all the music in the film...in fact, I felt there was some very solid stuff hidden here and there. The film started off with some great music (the theme during the GvsGotengo opening battle was fantastic, the opening credits theme is one of my favorite themes of the series, the subtle nod to Minilla's old theme was a nice touch, and the motorcyle chase theme later on really got the adrenaline running). But as far as I know, those weren't even composed by Emerson (if I am wrong, please feel free to correct me on this)...and his ending score was, as people described, more suitable for a video game ending or something played between innings at a baseball game...just terrible. And don't even get me started on that terrible Ebirah battle/Gotengo charge theme (though again, I don't know if Emerson was responsible for that putrid theme or not). :puke: Ebirah's factory scene stole the show, but his scene was nearly ruined by that annoying theme. Playing the awful "We're All to Blame" during the G/Zilla battle was totally rediculous and came out of left field, and the themes played during the both the monsters' world rampage and Godzilla's battle with Anguirus/KS/Rodan were both very hokey and detracted from what should have been epic scenes. The fact that the best themes of the film are Ifukube's classic KKvsG theme and Sato's GvsMG theme says volumes for most of the "new music"...

About the only positive I can say is that at least GFW's soundtrack wasn't as bad as Hattori's astrocious "made for TV-Direct to Video" work on GvsSG and G2k...but then again, that's not saying much...
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