TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Discuss the 2nd Godzilla film era here! Beam fights, revised versions of classic kaiju, the Heisei era was a mixed bag of fun and controversy!

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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby DannyBeane » Thu Apr 24, 2014 10:19 pm

If I had to pick a Heisei film that was as close to Godzilla vs Gigan in both complete insanity and entertainment, it would have to be Godzilla vs King Ghidorah and that must be the reason why I love this film so much!.
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby DannyBeane » Tue May 06, 2014 2:18 pm

So I am sitting here watching this film on blu ray and I have reaffirmed my suspicion that this is a Heisei film with the heart and craziness of a showa film. If you ignore the time travel loopholes and just have fun with this film its a blast. Aliens from the future, time travel, dinosaurs, robot cyborgs and terminator knockoffs? Sign me up for that anyday!
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby Gojilove » Tue May 06, 2014 2:36 pm

DannyBeane wrote:So I am sitting here watching this film on blu ray and I have reaffirmed my suspicion that this is a Heisei film with the heart and craziness of a showa film. If you ignore the time travel loopholes and just have fun with this film its a blast. Aliens from the future, time travel, dinosaurs, robot cyborgs and terminator knockoffs? Sign me up for that anyday!

Can't wait to finally pick this up on BD. Haters going to hate, its far from perfect but I enjoy the hell out of it.
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby planetxleader » Tue May 06, 2014 2:37 pm

It's the only '90s film that I unabashedly enjoy.
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby DannyBeane » Tue May 06, 2014 2:45 pm

Oh God, M-11's car just barely flips over and it randomly explodes into a giant fireball. That is some Michael Bay stuff right there! I need to get a theater poster of this film for Robert Scott Field to sign at G-fest. He's probably my favorite part of this film.

*Edit*
I would also like to point out this film probably has the best kaiju fight in the Heisei era. There is a good balance of beams and tooth n claw asskicking going on.
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby Hybrid Gojira » Tue May 06, 2014 4:23 pm

DannyBeane wrote:Oh God, M-11's car just barely flips over and it randomly explodes into a giant fireball. That is some Michael Bay stuff right there! I need to get a theater poster of this film for Robert Scott Field to sign at G-fest. He's probably my favorite part of this film.

*Edit*
I would also like to point out this film probably has the best kaiju fight in the Heisei era. There is a good balance of beams and tooth n claw asskicking going on.


Eh, Biollante and Rodan's first fight with Godzilla are up there for me.
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby davezilla » Tue May 06, 2014 9:13 pm

Watching this right now on blu-ray (in the original Japanese for the first time for me) and I am the same. I love this film with all my heart. Sure it feels a little more modern than the Showa era but it totally has a storyline and feel from the best of the Showa era. I love the time traveling spaceship, the "dinosaur" rescuing the Japanese army in WW2, the dorats (I would die to own one of those props they are so cute), the terminator android M-11, the fights, the music, even the really bad effects shots. I can't help it I love this film.

Sure it takes a bit to get to the monster action but I think the dialog and storyline are intelligent writing. 10/10 from me!

P.S. Seriously who out there has a Dorat prop who will let me buy it! I want it!
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby klen7 » Tue May 06, 2014 10:30 pm

davezilla wrote:P.S. Seriously who out there has a Dorat prop who will let me buy it! I want it!
i think the only Dorat releases are candy toy style. I don't think even Iwakura took on the Dorats. I'd like to be wrong, though i can't say i'd pay much for a Dorat figure. :)
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby davezilla » Wed May 07, 2014 8:00 am

Owning a Dorat prop would just be hilarious in my book....people would be like wth is this thing....

I'd be all like "Ummm...it's King Ghidorah before it be came King Ghidorah! Don't you know anything?" ROFLMAO
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby jellydonut25 » Wed May 07, 2014 11:38 am

I'd like to own a Dorat (mostly out of hope that one day I could own a King Ghidorah)
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby Alpha OTS » Wed May 07, 2014 10:51 pm

Finished watching the new bluray. Posting to say that my opinion of the movie is definitely improved by watching it with the original Japanese. I can agree that this movie contains all the elements that make for a good Showa flick, but there's illogic in the plot where the Emmy character motivations are concerned that still bother me.

What did Emmy think was going to happen to the dorats once she made sure they were exposed to the Godzilla-building nuclear blast? She says she's a moderate compared to the radicals in her group, but she had to know that the group's purpose was to stop Japan's growth before they left the future for the present. Ok, maybe she had a change of heart because the group's methods were too extreme once KG started rampaging, but again, what did she think was the purpose of the dorats? And once her loyalties to the group were clearly in doubt, she still has free reign of the ship to sabotage the group to their ultimate demise. It just seems like there's a few scenes missing which would explain this, or is this a case where the subtitle's missing some crucial exposition? Because you can see and hear in Emmy's expressions and voice that she feel's she's been doublecrossed once returning from the WW2 era. I'm not *as* bothered with this plot hole as I have been in the past, but I'm not sure if its because of the Japanese audio or because I've seen the movie enough times to look past it.

I'm still not quite a Heisei fan. I still don't really dig the Heisei aesthetics, whether its the G-suit, the miniatures or the backdrops. This movie, to me, really exudes that aesthetic.

Just put in GvMothra and am a little bummed that the title menu is *exactly* the same as GvKG. :(
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby jellydonut25 » Thu May 08, 2014 12:32 am

Emmy's a biatch. I hate her.
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby william newell » Sat Jul 12, 2014 6:10 pm

klen7 wrote:
davezilla wrote:P.S. Seriously who out there has a Dorat prop who will let me buy it! I want it!
i think the only Dorat releases are candy toy style. I don't think even Iwakura took on the Dorats. I'd like to be wrong, though i can't say i'd pay much for a Dorat figure. :)


Alternative Images had an unbuilt resin kit of a Dorat that they used to bring with them to Chiller. I'll have to keep an eye out at the next convention to see if it's still for sale...
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby Gojilove » Mon Jul 14, 2014 11:19 am

Emmy confuses me in all versions of this film. Watched it at the screening at G-Fest, it hit me that it was the THIRD viewing of this film for me this year.
I need a break....

Anyway, I'm still bothered by the whole connection between Emmy and Kenichiro - She basically hits on him at one point and then reveals that shes some distant grandchild of his. Is this supposed to be a Luke Leia thing? Because I'm not buying it.
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby XvGojira » Mon Jul 14, 2014 10:18 pm

Gojilove wrote:Emmy confuses me in all versions of this film. Watched it at the screening at G-Fest, it hit me that it was the THIRD viewing of this film for me this year.
I need a break....

Anyway, I'm still bothered by the whole connection between Emmy and Kenichiro - She basically hits on him at one point and then reveals that shes some distant grandchild of his. Is this supposed to be a Luke Leia thing? Because I'm not buying it.


I think it's more more Marty McFly and his Mom than Luke and Leia.
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby Benjamin Haines » Tue Jul 15, 2014 9:02 am

Gojilove wrote:Anyway, I'm still bothered by the whole connection between Emmy and Kenichiro - She basically hits on him at one point and then reveals that shes some distant grandchild of his. Is this supposed to be a Luke Leia thing? Because I'm not buying it.


It's such a hilariously messed up note to end this story on. Terasawa spends the whole movie getting along with Emmy, smiling when she hits on him before her first trip back to the future, and being completely indifferent to Chiaki's interest in him (and her answering machine marriage proposal). Then when Emmy is heading back to her time for good at the end, she casually reveals that they've been barking up an incestuous tree, leaving Terasawa with Chiaki at his side and the realization that he'll have to marry her so that Emmy can eventually be born.


A normal ending where the love story works out happily ever after? Never!
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby Gojilove » Tue Jul 15, 2014 9:54 am

Benjamin Haines wrote:
Gojilove wrote:Anyway, I'm still bothered by the whole connection between Emmy and Kenichiro - She basically hits on him at one point and then reveals that shes some distant grandchild of his. Is this supposed to be a Luke Leia thing? Because I'm not buying it.


It's such a hilariously messed up note to end this story on. Terasawa spends the whole movie getting along with Emmy, smiling when she hits on him before her first trip back to the future, and being completely indifferent to Chiaki's interest in him (and her answering machine marriage proposal). Then when Emmy is heading back to her time for good at the end, she casually reveals that they've been barking up an incestuous tree, leaving Terasawa with Chiaki at his side and the realization that he'll have to marry her so that Emmy can eventually be born.


A normal ending where the love story works out happily ever after? Never!


Its the love triangle we never get to see!
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby Gman2887 » Sun Jul 20, 2014 2:08 pm

Benjamin Haines wrote:Then when Emmy is heading back to her time for good at the end, she casually reveals that they've been barking up an incestuous tree, leaving Terasawa with Chiaki at his side and the realization that he'll have to marry her so that Emmy can eventually be born.


Because we never got a reaction shot from Terasawa I always assumed she was just talking to herself and Terasawa never found out. Rather, life, ah, found a way.
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby XvGojira » Sun Jul 20, 2014 7:20 pm

She just wants to be her own grandmother. Or who knows, because of Godzilla's rampaging he leaves the world slightly irradiated which in turn made most of the men of her time sterile. Or she just's one really kinky chick.
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby lhb412 » Mon Jul 21, 2014 8:58 pm

Didn't the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy list 'becoming your own grandparent' as one of the top reasons for time travel?

Just watched the Blu-Ray. Can't say watching it in it's original language helped it too much. Still firmly in the 'okay' category. The subtitles were largely dubtitles, but when the dub line seemed egregiously different from the original intent a more accurate translation was substituted. I guess it's the cheapest way to make a subtitle script: take the dub script, watch the movie, make corrections. Because of this certain things made more sense, like what kind of writer the main character is, the short discussion of why two versions of the same person can't exist at the same time is no longer incomprehensible.
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby Gohi » Sun Aug 03, 2014 9:25 pm

This film has not aged well for me. I can't stand the way Ghidorah is portrayed here. He has no personality at all, he's just a pawn, either for good or for evil. There's very little tension in the fights between him and Godzilla, in my opinion.
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby Jorzilla » Mon Aug 04, 2014 3:08 am

I rewatched this film over the weekend. It was better than I last remembered watching it, especially because I made an effort to pay attention to the effects and fight sequences. The one thing that DID bother me a lot: These new Blu Rays are too detailed. Watching it on my secondary monitor I could not help but notice a TON of wires used to bring KG to life. it was seriously distracting, especially because after awhile I knew where to look for them. I'm talking Monster Zero level of wire scenes. Same could be said for Godzilla vs. Mothra. In one scene, you can clearly see the massive hook that the cables attacked to on the back of Mothra's head.

On the plus side, I did finish the experience having a great appreciation for how hard it must have been to coordinate those puppets.
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby Hybrid Gojira » Mon Sep 15, 2014 9:12 pm

I just finished watching this a few minutes ago.

It's...not very good.

The story is a mess. The very idea of Time Travel carries so many inconsistencies in its own right...add to that the fact that MZ has a stickied thread explaining the Heisei timeline (specifically because of this movie) and that should tell you all you need to know about the sloppily written script.

The characters in this film don't do it for me. Teresawa is kind of a bore and he is more interested in Emmy than his girlfriend. Of course, it creepily turns out that Emmy and Teresawa are actually related. They should have dropped his girlfriend from the plot - she serves no real purpose. Shindo is the only character that's interesting, but even he cannot save this movie from being overly convoluted.

The effects are really mixed. The matte shots during Godzilla's initial appearance - the lighthouse on the cliff and the shot as he walks through a farm (complete with cows) - are breathtaking...but the destruction scenes and subsequent mattes used during KG's appearance are terrible. While I like the design of Ghidorah, he simply pales in comparison to the original in execution and his destruction scenes are far weaker. Kawakita basically takes cityscape matte shots and superimposes explosions - a common occurrence from this film on - and it doesn't work. I'm also not sure why Toho dropped KG's classic roar - the new roar is fine but it does not match the original in tone or personality.

On the other hand, Goji himself looks great. The design from this film is probably my all time favorite of the series. Godzilla is powerfully built and has a real presence on screen. He also retains his low, bellowing howl from G84 and Biollante, a fact that adds to his power on screen. Sadly, the miniatures in this movie are mostly dull and lifeless. The countryside set used when G and KG battle is very solid; the city sets later on are murky.

There are some good ideas in this movie. I like Mecha King Ghidorah. The Godzilla grip is a unique weapon and the way Godzilla defeats Ghidorah in their first fight is awesome. I also like the nuclear pulse, something we saw in Biollante but is also used to great effect here, blasting KG across the battlefield.

Did I mention how much M11 sucks in this? Yeah, you probably know by now.

Or the Dorats? What a horrible origin for Ghidorah, plus the props used for the Dorats are shoddy.

And again, those matte shots. Everything involving Godzillasaurus killing off the American fleet looks downright awful.

All in all, this movie kinda fails for me. It's not the worst and I like some aspects of it, but it's a middle of the road kinda G film.
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby Mac » Sun Feb 15, 2015 2:19 pm

Every-time I watch this movie I'm surprised by how thematically rich it is. It's verging on great.

Despite Emmy's hopeful vision of a super-power Japan, the film implies that the meddling of gaijin (Future men), sets off an unstoppable chain-reaction of events that can't be solved by Japan alone. It's easy to find parallels with the decade long financial recession Japan was facing at the time, and I think the film is very aware of this. Shindo's character essentially sees the fall of both periods of Japan, first as a soldier on the battlefield, and then as an executive in a high-tower.

There are a lot of cynical cycles here too. Just as the United States impeded Japan's progress in the 40's, so do the Future Men try to now. King Ghidorah is formed to defeat Godzilla. The new Godzilla is born out of man's attempt to stop King Ghidorah, and Mecha-King Ghidorah is created to stop the new Godzilla. Japan is incapable of escaping its past (and future).
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Re: TALKBACK#18: Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah

Postby king_ghidorah » Thu Feb 19, 2015 10:28 am

Agreed. There is some pretty thematically rich stuff present there. I feel like a lot of people get hung up on the nonsensical time travel stuff, but if you overlook that, or just have fun with it and turn your brain off, it's a really fun movie. Arguably my favorite of the Heisei era and in my top 5 overall.

One thing I don't think this film gets enough credit for is the near perfect depiction of Godzilla. He saves the day, then it's "OH "OH GODZILLA! WHAT TERRIBLE LANGUAGE!", he's pissed off now and heading towards a major city!" The movie totally switches gears and suddenly becomes a movie about stopping Godzilla, whereas minutes earlier he was our savior. Honestly, if there's any movie that encapsulates what Godzilla is to me it's this one.
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