Kong Did Win

Discuss the original series of Godzilla films! From "Terror of Tokyo" to Puppy-faced Super-hero, the Showa Era had something for everyone!

Moderator: Controllers

Kong Did Win

Postby kpa » Wed Dec 31, 2003 4:38 pm

Here's the KING KONG VS GODZILLA plot description from Toho. While it condenses the story considerably, it leaves no doubt about who Toho says won the final battle.

This was published in Toho Films a few months after the movie was released in 1962. IMO, the fact that it was written close to the movie's creation and at a time when Honda, Tsuburaya, Tanaka, Sekizawa, etc were still alive adds far more credibility to it than any "retroactive" thinking on Toho's part (I should also add I've never seen Toho officially contradict what was written in 1962).

Hopefully this will put this matter to rest. :lol: :lol:

Image
Keith
Image
User avatar
kpa
Monster 01
 
Posts: 3273
Joined: Fri Jul 04, 2003 5:39 pm
Location: CA

Postby william newell » Wed Dec 31, 2003 5:30 pm

Wahhhhh.. my illusions are shattered....wahhhhhhh...
william newell
Heisei Godzilla
 
Posts: 1594
Joined: Mon Oct 27, 2003 2:29 pm
Location: Hamilton, New Jersey

Postby william newell » Wed Dec 31, 2003 5:30 pm

Wahhhhh.. my illusions are shattered....wahhhhhhh...
william newell
Heisei Godzilla
 
Posts: 1594
Joined: Mon Oct 27, 2003 2:29 pm
Location: Hamilton, New Jersey

Postby CyHunter » Wed Dec 31, 2003 5:55 pm

Of course, we've all known this for a long time--where it gets sticky is the fact that now Toho's press dept. says it was a tie, which seems to better reflect the movie's end itself IMO--*sigh* this'll never end. :roll: Soo confused!
CyHunter
Burning Godzilla
 
Posts: 3977
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2003 12:17 pm
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Postby Xenorama » Wed Dec 31, 2003 5:59 pm

What's confusing about it?
User avatar
Xenorama
Monster 01
 
Posts: 3027
Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2003 10:10 pm
Location: L77

Postby CyHunter » Wed Dec 31, 2003 6:07 pm

Um...that there are conflicting reports even within Toho? It would be one thing if Toho's PR said Kong won, and it was just a bunch of crazed Godzilla fanboys with bruised egos fighting it, but now the question is what should you be listening to--old Toho or new Toho? Old Toho would know, having made the movie--but now that they say it was a tie, oy... And of course one fan's opinion means nothing, but IMO there's nothing conclusive in the film itself that says Kong won, so I personally lean towards the latter...
CyHunter
Burning Godzilla
 
Posts: 3977
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2003 12:17 pm
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Postby kpa » Wed Dec 31, 2003 6:12 pm

CyHunter wrote:Of course, we've all known this for a long time--where it gets sticky is the fact that now Toho's press dept. says it was a tie,


Cy, exactly when and where did they say this? I've read numerous reports this was said, but have never actually seen such a statement come officially from Toho. If an official Toho statement exists I'd love to see it.

In any case, I'll take what was said at the time of the movie's release than something written decades later by someone who wasn't involved with the production. It's like if, decades from now, someone at Toho changes a plot point in GODZILLA X MEGAGUIRUS... since that would not be what Toho or the filmmakers intended it would be meaningless IMO.
Keith
Image
User avatar
kpa
Monster 01
 
Posts: 3273
Joined: Fri Jul 04, 2003 5:39 pm
Location: CA

Postby CyHunter » Wed Dec 31, 2003 6:30 pm

Hmm...well, I assumed it said somewhere on the godzilla.co.jp site, but of course I can't read Japanese and can't decipher altavista-speak :lol:

If it doesn't say this anywhere and I and a bajillion other people who've "heard from a friend" are actually wrong, then I guess Kong did win.

As for the comparison to GxM, I'm not sure that's totally accurate. Changing a hard, factual plot point is one thing. Changing a general blanket opinion of a corperation that isn't identified anywhere in the film is another. But at that point, the whole opinion becomes moot.

I guess it's just so messy to me I like to say it was a tie and leave it at that. :lol:

As it is, I suppose this is the closest thing to an "official Toho statement"; I'll give you that. :)
CyHunter
Burning Godzilla
 
Posts: 3977
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2003 12:17 pm
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Postby swfreakjpb » Wed Dec 31, 2003 6:37 pm

Well I guess it does not get any more official then that. I am surprised That toho would do that though, have Kong be the winner. I always assumed it was a draw and they just both had enough and left.
Joined in 1997

"Godzilla doesn't give a crap about France" (Tom Green)

Where's a Giant Monster when you need one?
User avatar
swfreakjpb
Godzilla
 
Posts: 676
Joined: Sat Aug 09, 2003 1:07 am
Location: Rochester, NY

Postby CyHunter » Wed Dec 31, 2003 6:42 pm

Yeah, if they wanted to make it clear, why didn't they just have Kong rip his head off and later come up onshore, and have Goji wink at the camera? :wink:
CyHunter
Burning Godzilla
 
Posts: 3977
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2003 12:17 pm
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Postby Trenton Fella » Wed Dec 31, 2003 6:53 pm

what is kong holding in the 2nd picture? Is that a flaming sword?!?!
Trenton Fella
 

Postby kpa » Wed Dec 31, 2003 7:32 pm

TrentonFella_83 wrote:what is kong holding in the 2nd picture? Is that a flaming sword?!?!


It's a burning tree.
Keith
Image
User avatar
kpa
Monster 01
 
Posts: 3273
Joined: Fri Jul 04, 2003 5:39 pm
Location: CA

Postby Trenton Fella » Wed Dec 31, 2003 7:42 pm

kpa wrote:
TrentonFella_83 wrote:what is kong holding in the 2nd picture? Is that a flaming sword?!?!


It's a burning tree.


Oh ok, thanks for clearing that up :D
Trenton Fella
 

Postby kpa » Wed Dec 31, 2003 7:45 pm

TrentonFella_83 wrote:
kpa wrote:
TrentonFella_83 wrote:what is kong holding in the 2nd picture? Is that a flaming sword?!?!


It's a burning tree.


Oh ok, thanks for clearing that up :D


No problem. If you look at that photo again you'll see Godzilla is generously lighting up another tree for Kong to play with. Who says they don't like each other?
Keith
Image
User avatar
kpa
Monster 01
 
Posts: 3273
Joined: Fri Jul 04, 2003 5:39 pm
Location: CA

Postby Tomzilla » Wed Dec 31, 2003 8:41 pm

Hmmm...maybe if I were a few years younger, I'd freak out and say this is all crap. Then I'd probably spend hours on how this isn't what it seems...

But, luckily, I'll take the easy way out and accept it. Personally, I don't care anymore who won or lost.

(Just think how people would act if 'Godzilla vs. Gamera' did happen...generations after generations would argue over who really won... :P )
User avatar
Tomzilla
Godzilla Jr.
 
Posts: 463
Joined: Mon Jul 28, 2003 8:28 pm
Location: Seattle

Postby Severn » Wed Dec 31, 2003 8:57 pm

At the time Kong was the big name brand and Godzilla was a newbie (it was only his 3rd movie after all). So it doesn't surprise me that kong won. Still that does that mean that King Ghidorah won in Monster Zero because the ending was the same as Kong's.
Severn
 

Postby kaijubringer » Wed Dec 31, 2003 10:12 pm

What does the writer of the article mean by “winâ€
kaijubringer
Godzilla
 
Posts: 517
Joined: Sat Aug 09, 2003 2:29 pm

Postby CyHunter » Wed Dec 31, 2003 10:34 pm

^^excellent point, and exactly why I don't put much faith in what Toho said in '62, even if it is "official". If Kong only wanted to get back to his island home, and Godzilla only wanted to stop him (for whatever reason), then Godzilla clearly would've been the loser. But as it stands, the ending is totally inconclusive. Again, my belief in this is not at all driven by that stupid fanboyish hostility towards any desire in which Godzilla loses. It just doesn't 'compute' how that ending in any way represents a victory for Kong; by the same token, nor does it indicate a loss by Goji.
CyHunter
Burning Godzilla
 
Posts: 3977
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2003 12:17 pm
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Postby Garasharp K7 » Thu Jan 01, 2004 7:43 pm

I have to wonder - would people make such a big fuss if Godzilla had popped up and swam away at the end?
Probably not. :)
"Godzilla's the one with the bad breath." - Minya
User avatar
Garasharp K7
Godzilla
 
Posts: 745
Joined: Sat Aug 09, 2003 8:20 am
Location: Ireland

Postby Drill-Arm_Godzilla » Thu Jan 01, 2004 9:35 pm

Yes then they would cmplain how no one won the fight.
Drill-Arm_Godzilla
 

Postby 234fanatical » Wed Jan 07, 2004 4:33 pm

I agree with both Kaiju and Cy
234fanatical
Little Godzilla
 
Posts: 139
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2003 10:55 pm

Postby nebullaone » Wed Jan 07, 2004 8:34 pm

Hi G-Sters,

Doesn't really matter to me whether Toho said or says King won or Godzilla won, because I know in my heart that Kong can never ever ever ever ever in one million years even dream of beating Godzilla in any form of combat. :D

Godzilla is just too powerful...end of story. :)

PEACE

Ramsin
nebullaone
 

Postby CyHunter » Wed Jan 07, 2004 9:14 pm

Well, I have no problem with the movie Kong beating him fair and square, but my beef with Toho saying he won is that it conflicts with what I interpret having been seen on-screen.
CyHunter
Burning Godzilla
 
Posts: 3977
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2003 12:17 pm
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Postby Mechagodzilla » Wed Jan 07, 2004 10:48 pm

nebullaone wrote:Hi G-Sters,

Doesn't really matter to me whether Toho said or says King won or Godzilla won, because I know in my heart that Kong can never ever ever ever ever in one million years even dream of beating Godzilla in any form of combat. :D

Godzilla is just too powerful...end of story. :)

PEACE

Ramsin


Kinda like when he lost to battle to Mothra! Now, everyone will say ''trHey cHeatED!!1 mothra sux!!1''

:D
Mechagodzilla
 

Postby CyHunter » Wed Jan 07, 2004 11:27 pm

No, I think the Mothra larva clearly won, because they completed their goal..protecting themselves and the humans from Godzilla in that battle. Even though he wasn't killed, I don't think that was a realistic option or necissarily their goal. However, with Kong, it was a "fight to the DEATH!!!!!!", if you get me, and so for Kong to simply escape and Godzilla to hit his head and presumably pass out isn't really a victory for either side, but just an inconclusive tie.
CyHunter
Burning Godzilla
 
Posts: 3977
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2003 12:17 pm
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Next

Return to The Showa Era: 1954-1975

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest