Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby jellydonut25 » Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:46 am

For me personally, the Frieza stuff was the only stuff that REALLY didn't age well for me upon revisiting the uncut series just recently.

I remembered not really being enamored with the stuff up until the various fights with Frieza as a kid, but even the Frieza stuff just felt too slow this time out.

But the Cell stuff, for me personally, was excellent as usual, and I really enjoyed the Buu arc, especially the Babidi and Kid Buu sagas.

So, yeah, for me, the Namek/Frieza stuff is the only stuff that is a tough re-watch under the old dub. Oddly enough, it's also the stuff with the least memorable Faulconer scores (for me), so if/when I ultimately purchase blu-rays for DBZ, I might cobble together an uncut/Kai thing.
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby MekaGojira3k » Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:28 pm

Once the fight with Frieza actually starts it slows downnn. I feel like the Cell Games are the same way. Although, I feel like I love the build up to Cell more than the build up to Frieza.
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby jellydonut25 » Fri Jun 05, 2015 2:34 pm

MekaGojira3k wrote:Once the fight with Frieza actually starts it slows downnn. I feel like the Cell Games are the same way. Although, I feel like I love the build up to Cell more than the build up to Frieza.

I guess it depends which fight with Cell you mean. I feel like Goku's battle with Cell isn't overly slow. Gohan's is a little bit, but it has a more satisfying emotional arc for me.

This is actually kinda where I get my preference for Vegeta more than Goku. Vegeta allows things to get more personal, which is why once he's put out of commission by Frieza, the fight loses some interest. Goku doesn't care about the Saiyans, so he kinda doesn't care about Frieza. When Vegeta's involved, he's so much more "You're a jerk because of what this has done to ME" that it all feels more personal and more emotionally invested. Goku's got a bit of the Superman complex. SO heroic, SO powerful, and SO kind-hearted, he's difficult to relate to.
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby MekaGojira3k » Fri Jun 05, 2015 11:03 pm

jellydonut25 wrote:
MekaGojira3k wrote:Once the fight with Frieza actually starts it slows downnn. I feel like the Cell Games are the same way. Although, I feel like I love the build up to Cell more than the build up to Frieza.

I guess it depends which fight with Cell you mean. I feel like Goku's battle with Cell isn't overly slow. Gohan's is a little bit, but it has a more satisfying emotional arc for me.

This is actually kinda where I get my preference for Vegeta more than Goku. Vegeta allows things to get more personal, which is why once he's put out of commission by Frieza, the fight loses some interest. Goku doesn't care about the Saiyans, so he kinda doesn't care about Frieza. When Vegeta's involved, he's so much more "You're a jerk because of what this has done to ME" that it all feels more personal and more emotionally invested. Goku's got a bit of the Superman complex. SO heroic, SO powerful, and SO kind-hearted, he's difficult to relate to.


Yeah, I've never been all that fond of Goku. The Android stuff is really entertaining (discovery of Cell and the like) and Goku is nowhere near that action. It's better for it. There's a risk there that you don't get with Goku being there. I started preferring Vegeta to Goku in the Frieza saga. I tend to like villains and villain-ish characters more anyhow. XD
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby Dr Kain » Sat Jun 06, 2015 10:55 am

I really would love to see the Freeza and Goku fight redone like the manga. In the manga, once Goku turns SS, the fight never goes back into Freeza's corner.
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby MekaGojira3k » Sat Jun 06, 2015 1:59 pm

Finished the Broly movies. Is it weird that I felt like they got better as they went along? I mean, Broly sucks, but the circumstances around him seemed to get more entertaining. Bio-Broly is completely bizarre and I kind of loved that.
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby Gman2887 » Sat Jun 06, 2015 6:03 pm

jellydonut25 wrote:I'm with MekaGojira here. Saiyan saga, namek saga, ginyu saga, frieza saga, trunks saga, android saga, imperfect cell saga, perfect cell saga, cell games saga, great saiyaman saga, world tournament saga, babidi saga, majin buu saga, fusion saga, kid buu saga.


My problem with these divisions isn't that they aren't Japanese, they're just pointless and strung out. I didn't even know half of these Funimation made into "Sagas". "Imperfect cell" saga? Babidi Saga? I was around for all this and never even noticed those. It's so much simpler to just divide them into the Saiyan, Freeza, Android/Cell and Buu arcs. It's a shorter list, easier to remember and doesn't feel like someone's making up more Sagas just to market extra boxsets.
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby MekaGojira3k » Sun Jun 07, 2015 10:00 pm

Well, we're into the Fusion Saga and I've finished Fusion Reborn. I really like it, honestly. The Hitler bits were a bit weird, but I liked Janemba enough. Especially his final form and his teleporting ability. The animation looked really good in this one.

As for the Buu stuff. I feel like it starts to drag after Vegeta self destructs. It kind of picks up when Gotenks is ready, but my god. Gotenks is frustrating. It's also frustrating that Gohan getting his mystic power up gets sort of forgotten so quickly. It wasn't as quick as I remember it, but damn, he's already eaten.
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby Shin_Edda_Robo!!!!! » Sun Jun 07, 2015 10:42 pm

On Trunks and Goten's antics...

I find happiness in knowing that Gohan and Piccolo have more faith in Tien, Krillin, and Master Roshi than Trunks and Goten, despite being stronger than them, which is why they brought them along to fight Freeza's invading army than the inherently unpredictable and careless Trunks and Goten.
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby MekaGojira3k » Tue Jun 09, 2015 9:51 pm

Watched Wrath of the Dragon. It was, alright. The monster didn't really feel Toriyama-ish (which happens with the movie stuff, but it felt incredibly weird). I liked Tapion well enough, weird that the Dragon is back to one wish for this film. I guess one wish is all the film needed.

Anyhow, taking a bit of a break to watch the JP films, then back toward the finish of DBZ.
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby Gman2887 » Wed Jun 10, 2015 10:29 pm

Wrath of the Dragon is one of my favorites for a multitude of fun reasons. I feel like if you really wanted it to, you could fit it into the post-Buu canon of DBZ. It works decently enough. I love how it's young Trunks' movie and the focus is mostly on his relationship with Tapion.
And I adore Vegeta's brief stint in this. No it doesn't make sense that Super Saiyan 2 Vegeta stands up to Hirudigon better than Mystic Gohan, but whatever. He was practically the show's second billed main character by this point anyway.
I think it's one of the best and much better than the first Broly movie which is far overrated to this day.
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby Dr Kain » Thu Jun 11, 2015 1:07 am

I have mixed feelings on Wrath of the Dragon. I do not know why, but it seems like I enjoy this one a lot more every other time I watch it. It does a good job at trying to tell a story, but that is just it, it tries to tell a story and fails at it. The nice thing is that it focused on Trunks more than anyone else.

The wishes of the Dragon Balls get weird though, really weird.
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby jellydonut25 » Thu Jun 11, 2015 2:11 am

Finished up GT recently.

It's certainly not good, but I do think it's a tad over-hated. I mean, if we can enjoy the movies for what they are, why not GT? It's definitely got its problems, but I think once it gets back to Earth it's mostly decent enough. Plus, the whole thing is only like 60 episodes, so it's just like one DBZ saga. MAYBE two.
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby Dr Kain » Thu Jun 11, 2015 9:57 am

jellydonut25 wrote:Finished up GT recently.

It's certainly not good, but I do think it's a tad over-hated. I mean, if we can enjoy the movies for what they are, why not GT? It's definitely got its problems, but I think once it gets back to Earth it's mostly decent enough. Plus, the whole thing is only like 60 episodes, so it's just like one DBZ saga. MAYBE two.


There are many reasons why I personally hate GT. Some of them included:

It is boring.

Piccolo is my favorite character and he is everyone's "OH GODZILLA! WHAT TERRIBLE LANGUAGE!" in GT.

The plots are recycled. Mu is Space Gero and Baby is Space Cell, while the Super 17 arc is just the plot to Fusion Reborn.

Goku is under powered. In fact, none of the characters even feel like Toriyama's characters.

Have I mentioned that it is just flat out boring?

The ending makes no sense.

Now I did like the idea of the evil Shenrons, but it was written like it was an after thought that it comes out clumsy. The animation and music is probably the best thing about the show.
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby Gman2887 » Thu Jun 11, 2015 1:15 pm

There are ideas in GT I like, but I can't get through it as much as I try. I think there's way too much focus on Goku and unlike DBZ it really doesn't give anyone else time in the sun before he swoops in to save the day.
I remember the moment I turned it off was when Goku told others that some minor villain they bumped into was stronger than Majin Buu. He then proceeded to fight the character in his base form.
Also not a fan of the red herring. We almost get adult Gotenks before who shoots the idea down? Goku. I don't know; a lot of missed opportunities with good ideas and too much Goku made it feel really boring. I just can't get into it.
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby jellydonut25 » Fri Jun 12, 2015 12:18 am

Nothing you guys are saying is necessarily WRONG (except for the under-powered thing, which I don't even think is "wrong" as much as it is just a mis-read. He's way more powerful, but the animators/directors did a TERRIBLE job of showing the power of the fighters clashing together throughout the show. In DBZ, a punch from SSJ3 Goku would shatter mountains. In GT, SSJ4 Goku blasts a Kamehameha and it's just blue light shooting from his hands), but I think there's just a smidge enough to like for it to fall a tad more on the side of "it's good" than bad for me personally. Especially once the Baby stuff starts. Most of the stuff before that is pretty bad, but afterward, at least it's got a lot of our old characters again even if they get pushed to the background too often.
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby Gman2887 » Fri Jun 12, 2015 3:04 am

Even the Baby stuff bored me. I don't know... It just felt like much of the cast had been pushed so far in the back that there wasn't enough to watch GT for. It got depressingly dull and I'm not really saying that out of any sense of exaggeration. I was literally feeling bad while watching how little the show had to offer. For a shorter episode count it sure does seem to drag a lot more than Z. Going from how fun and light DBZ was to how drab and slow GT is was a task I deemed unworthy of my time, thus I've never watched it in its entirety. Yes, I've seen the key fights, the Super Saiyan 4 transformation, the last episodes, etc, by now, but it's just not enough fun-- The number one sin of anything DragonBall related.

In any case, with the new movies and DBS coming out it looks like I don't have to think too much about it anymore. Battle of Gods alone would've been a more satisfying conclusion than DBGT.
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby MekaGojira3k » Wed Jun 17, 2015 10:28 pm

Finished DBZ, watched Path to Power (which is, so far, my favorite of the movies) and we're making our way into Dragon Ball GT. It feels....off. I mean, it's trying to be very "Dragon Ball" but it doesn't really succeed. The two-parter that is effectively the single episode Oolong story highlights my issues. It feels like it has the makings of an episode-of-the-week show but then wants to be serialized and draws out things that I don't care about (fight with the elite robots).

I've never seen this before so it's all new. Dr. Myuu is space Gero though. Look at him. GERO IN SPAAAACEEEE.

I also bought the first 15 volumes of Dragon Ball at a Weaboo Convention this weekend.
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby jellydonut25 » Thu Jun 18, 2015 12:59 am

GT's not good.


I think it's not AS bad as its reputation though.
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby MekaGojira3k » Mon Jun 22, 2015 11:15 pm

Well, watched A Hero's Legacy and finished the Black Star Dragon Ball and Baby Sagas.
It's kind of a shame, the Baby stuff was wayyy more interesting, and I liked the twist about him being related to the Tuffles.
But it's sloppy, and it's more sloppy than when Toriyama is sloppy. I think it's because it's trying to do so much with it.
I think the battle goes on a bit long once Goku goes Super Saiyan 4, but generally I enjoyed myself. I understand why people have issue with GT,
but I'm enjoying it for what it is.
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby MekaGojira3k » Fri Jun 26, 2015 9:13 pm

Finished GT. Aaand, Wow. Super 17 felt like a movie, and the Shadow Dragon Saga felt like it was even more of a misstep than the earlier part of GT.
I still really like Baby for whatever reason. The Super Saiyan 4 Vegeta and Gogeta felt severely underused. Syn Shenron could have used with an actual transformation when he got all of the Dragon Balls. I also felt like it would have been nice if the Shadow Dragons had forms that somehow related to their wishes/wish makers or something.
I actually really liked Nova Shenron.

GT: A Hero's Legacy was, well, it was a thing. It could have been wayy more interesting, but it felt like a wasted opportunity. Also, it felt weird that it aired so far ahead of the final episode. Oh well.

We also watched some of the other OVA things
Son Goku and His Friends Return - Vegeta having a brother was a bit dumb, but I liked how fun this was. I especially liked getting to see Krillin and Yamcha do something.
Episode of Bardock was...weird, but harmless. It's a bit ridiculous to retroactively add even more importance to Bardock, but whatevs. I enjoyed it.
Plan to Eradicate the Saiyans/Super Saiyans - Dumb, less interesting version of Baby..kind of (Though I'm aware this came first). Anyhow, pretty forgettable.
I also watched the Dragon Ball/Toriko/One Piece crossover. I wish I knew more about those shows. Although, I'm about to read some One PIece I picked up. It was a goofy set of episodes, but the whole thing dragged a bit given I was only interested in 1/3 of the cast.

Battle of Gods - Wow. I've not been thrilled with the Beerus design or the Super Saiyan God form look, so I wasn't expecting much. This is so much fun. I hated the one shot of CG characters (Which looked like a Xenoverse cut scene), but the rest was fun. Tons of great humor. I can't wait to see Resurrection "F" this August.
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby Dr Kain » Sat Jun 27, 2015 2:06 am

Battle of Gods blew me away. I went in expecting another all action no plot movie with another generic more powerful than everyone else that Goku is going to beat villain and it wasn't anything like that. Beerus is by far Toriyama's most original DB character in a long time (not long time as in real time, but long time as in most original from probably before Goku married Chichi). It had a plot and was not all action. I love the scene when Beerus challenges Oolong to a game of Rock Paper Scissors. Oh, and the line, "26 minutes? That is the average length of an anime episode," was hilarious. Not to mention that Beerus was not another evil being and Goku didn't actually win.
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby jellydonut25 » Sun Jun 28, 2015 2:18 am

Battle of Gods is great stuff. I hope I can get to see Resurrection F but I don't know if it will happen.
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby Dr Kain » Sun Jun 28, 2015 12:33 pm

jellydonut25 wrote:Battle of Gods is great stuff. I hope I can get to see Resurrection F but I don't know if it will happen.


Why not?

Anyway, I got my tickets for F for Mon Aug 10th at 10PM.
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Re: Dragon Ball Series(es) Talkback Discussion and Stuff

Postby jellydonut25 » Mon Jun 29, 2015 12:14 pm

I'll have a roughly one week old son. AND I already have a 13-month-old daughter.
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